THE FARMER'S MAGAZINE. 



15 



feet, and four feet. The outfalls of all the drains were visible, 

 so that anyone could at ouce see iu which the tains which had 

 fallen ran first; and having been there frequently himself, he 

 could never perceive very much ditference in point of speed 

 between the different drains. No doubt some diffeieuce 

 would be discovered on a careful examination, but he had not 

 perceived any. The effect of the drainage as a whole was 

 such that uo one could tell where the shallow drainage was, 

 and where the deep drainage was — the soil was equally pro- 

 ductive ; and he concluded therefore, iu this case, that, as 

 shallow drainage involved the least expense, it was preferable 

 to deep drainai^e. 



A A3 EMBER : You have been speaking of grass lauds oi.ly. 



Mr. Parkinson continued : Tne land to which he had 

 been alluding was all ploughed land. He could tell Mr. 

 Denton of an iustai;ce iu which Elkingtou's system of draining 

 had been put in operation within the last few years. There was 

 a large tract of boggy land, the outbreak of Sherwood Forest 

 springs, which was attempted to be drained for a number of 

 years, in a great variety cf ways, the attempts all failing, be- 

 cause those who made them could uot get beneath the water. 

 Mr. Mild ward happened to get hold of some land in the vicinity 

 which commanded this, though it did not appear at first to be 

 conuected with it; aud when a drain had been opened there, 

 the water rushed out with great force, the result being that 

 the land in question was completely drained, on the Elkiugton 

 system. 



Mons. Trehonnais thought the practical conclusion to be 

 arrived at, as the result of that evening's discussion, was — 

 that no one principle or system of draiuage should be dogma- 

 tically proclaimed as applicable to all descriptions of lands 

 (Hear, hear). The value of the discussion arose chiefly from 

 the lact that those who took part in it represented different 

 parts of England, with all their differences of geological for- 

 mation aud soil ; while he himself appeared there to represent 

 France in this matter. It could uot fail to be advantageous 

 to elicit the opinions of practical men with regard to the 

 drainage of the land with which^ey had to deal. Mr. Wood 

 had fouud that, iu the case cf high lands, the best course was 

 to lay the drain up-hill. His own practice was the reverse of 

 this. Ou his farm in France, he was engaged in extensive 

 draining operations on such land last winter. He was obliged 

 to hy bis drains perpendicularly to the dip 1 1 the land, hav- 

 ing been taught by obser'vation and experience that the other 

 practice would not prove satisfactory. Having devoted atten- 

 tion for some years to what he nii»ht term scientific draiuage, 

 he contended that the aid cf science was by no means to be 

 despised. Scientific priLciples like those laid down by Mr. 

 Nesbit were, in his opinion, very useful guides iu the prac- 

 tical operations of draiuage. In this matter, as in many others, 

 what was especially needed was, a combination of science 

 with practice ; aud this would, he believed, prevent a vast 

 amount of useless expenditure, and labour in vain. 



Mr. Thomas (of Bletsoe) said : I would not trouble you at 

 this late hour after so much has been said on the subject had 

 not ray own experience (which has extended over a period ex- 

 ceeding twenty-five years) led me to a different conclusion from 

 that of several of the previous speakers, in regard to draining 

 stiff claps. 1 am of opinion that three feet is a depth suffi- 

 cient iu such lands ; a less depth would be liable to injury 

 from cart-wheels and other casualties. Diaias four ftet deep 

 would not be so effective in such soils placed at a greater dis- 

 tance apart ; and the advantages arising from drains of such 

 a depth would uot compensate for the extra expense or cost. 

 However, on soils of a different character — for instance, mixed 

 soils, it would be desirable to go four feet, or even more ; 

 having myself drained such soils to the extent of five, and in a 

 few iustances as much aa six feet. It is, therefore, difficult to 

 lay down any system as a general rule; and I am glad to find 

 that my practical experience has been confirmed by much that 

 has been advanced by Mr. Nisbet on the subject. 



Mr. [C. M. BiDWELL (Ely) said, having been present at 

 many discussions ou the subject of drainage, he was very glad, 

 as a practical man, to see that the question of deep drainage 

 versus shallow draiuage was bein? reduced to a very narrow com- 

 pass, namely, between three feet and three feet four iuches, and 

 four feet. He thought they were nearly all progressing more and 

 more towards four (eet. He had seen a great deal of draining 

 done at that depth, aud he did not know a single instance 

 connected with strong clay lauds in which experience was not 

 in favour of a depth of four feet. He had been over a farm in 



Sussex that day, in the neighbourhood of Mr. Wood's farm ; 

 and in that case the drainage was carried to the depth which 

 ha had mentioned, and the result was highly satisfactory. He 

 hoped that iu a few years they would all adopt a minimum 

 depth of four feet. 



Mona. Trehonnais hoped he should be allowed to supply 

 an omission iu the remarks which had fallen from him. He 

 had intended to allude to the loss which the agriculturists 

 both of England and France had sustained in the lamented death 

 of the late Mr. Trimmer. (Hear, hear.) During a great part 

 of his life that gentleman bestowed more attention on the sub- 

 ject of draiuage than almost any one in that room ; and he 

 thought he rightly interpreted the feelings of all the members 

 of that club when he said that they regretted the loss sus- 

 taiued by geology and agriculture in the death of that distin- 

 guished man. (Hear, hear.) 



Mr. C. Stokes (Kingston, Kegworth) had seen a good 

 deal of draining., aud of the effects produced by draining in 

 the counties of Nottingham, Leicester, and Derby, and he 

 must testify that iu the last five-and-twenty years there had 

 been a very great improvement there in that respect. When 

 they first began to drain in that part of the country, thirty or 

 forty years ago, they put tiles in the ground from 12 to 18 

 inches deep, and in a very few years this proved to be of no use. 

 Mr Parkes' systemlwas then introduced; about six or seven 

 hundred acres were drained ou this system, and he had not 

 seen a single case of failure. It was strong land, but not 

 entirely clay, there being a good deal cf marl. He did not 

 know a single failure at a depth of four feet. When that system 

 was first adopted, there was hardly a person in the neighbour- 

 hood who did not laugh at it ; now no one scarcely drained at a 

 depth less than four feet. He was satisfied that it was a great 

 mistake to suppose that water would not percolate through 

 the soil at that depth. Let the air get into the land, by 

 making the drains, aud that would make a way for the 

 water. He did not wish to find fault with what had 

 fallen from gentlemen who came from other parts of the 

 kingdom ; but as regarded that part of the country in which 

 he lived, he was convinced that no practice answered so well aa 

 that which he had mentioned. (Hear, hear.) One word with 

 regard to what had beeu said by Mr. Thomas about the over 

 draining of grass lands. He fully admitted that for a year or 

 two grass lands might appear to have been over-drained, 

 the water having been taken away which previously tended 

 to produce a coarse kind of grasses. The remedy for this, 

 however, was to put some manure on the land ; and when that 

 had beeu done judiciously, the advantage of draining would 

 soon be visible in the production of grasses of a better descrip- 

 tion. (Hear, hear.) A friend of his, who drained some grass 

 lands soon aftervsarns, remarked to him that it was injured. 

 The next year he (Mr. Stokes) asked him if he still considered 

 it injured by draining. " Oh, uo," was the reply ; " I never saw 

 finer grass land in my life." (Hear, hear.) If the draiuiniE; of 

 grass land were followed by a proper application of manure, 

 the laud would soon come round again. In conclusion, he 

 wonld observe that they had not heard any gentleman say that 

 evening, that having put his drain pipes four feet deep, he had 

 beeu compelled to pull them out a»aiu. Ou the otlier band, he 

 had himself drained at a depth of two feet and a-balf, and the 

 result was most unsatisfactory. 



Mr. B. Denton could uot help expressing his concurrence 

 iu the remarks of Mons. Trehonnais, respecting the death of 

 Mr. Trimmer. He had beeu frequently opposed to Mr. Trimmer 

 in his views relating to drainage, but there was no man for 

 whose exertions and character he entertained a greater re- 

 spect. 



Mr. G. H. Ramsay (Newcastlc-on-Tyne) must express his 

 dissent from the notion which appeared to exist in the 

 minds of some practical, farmers that there was something like 

 opposition between practice and theory. lie might point to 

 the most practical man in that room, aud predicate of him, 

 that before he became a practical man, as regarded drainage, 

 he was to some extent a theorist (Hear, hear). He thought 

 it was high time to do away with the foolish distinction which 

 was often drawn between theory and practice. What they 

 had to aim at, in seeking perfection in drainage, was the proper 

 combination of practice and theory (Hear, hear). They did 

 not ask Mr. Nesbit how they were to use a spade or to dig 

 their drains ; they looked to him for the enunciation of scien- 

 tific principles, and all they had to do was to consider the 

 general rules which he had laid down ; he was not so foolish 



