THE FARMER'S MAGAZINE. 



265 



Mr. Williams (Baydon, Ilungerford) observed that tie 

 gentleman who introduced the subject appeared to differ from 

 the wise kin;? of Israel in his declaration that all rivers emptied 

 themselves into the sea. Was it not possible tliat the 

 reclamation of lands in the Lincolnshire district had been 

 carried so far as to do away with the outlets for the rivers 

 there ? 



Mr. S. Sidney (Peckham) said this was not merely 

 a tenant-farmer's or landlord's, but a national question — 

 a question affecting in the closest manner the cultivation of 

 the soil aud the production of food (Hear, bear). It could 

 not be solved satisfactorily without a great amount of 

 labour aud a lar^e expenditure of money, and the money 

 required conld not be supplied by the parties interested, but 

 must in great part be coiittibuteil, by the whole nation. Mr. 

 Clarke, who had so ably introduced the subject, had done 

 good service some years a^o, by meau-f of an admirable paper 

 in the Journal of lite lloijul A(jricuUural Society. They all 

 knew, however, that in tliis country, although it miffht be 

 right that a particular thinsr should be done, it could not 

 until the p\iblic were convinced that it was right ; and unless 

 such men as Mr. Ciarka, Mr. Bailey Denton, and other 

 gentlemen present whose modesty had prevented them from 

 speakin^', reduced their information to paper, aud circulated it 

 among the ptrsons to be influenced, the purae-strings of the 

 nation would not be unloosed for the accomplishment of the 

 object. It had occurred to him that in this matter very ex- 

 cellent service might be rendered by the Royal Agricultural 

 Society. That Society liad no doubt done a great deal for 

 agriculture ; but he was one of those who ventured to say 

 that it might do a great deal more, and that, having acquired 

 the confidence of the public, it 6hould actively exert its influence 

 to retain that confidence. He thought, for example, that that 

 Society might advantageously appoint a committee to draw up 

 a number of questions, to circulate them among persons who 

 lived on the borders of rivers, and who were therefore subject 

 to the evils of alteraats floo liug and dry seasons ; and with the 

 assistance of the answers, draw up a report for the guidance of 

 Parliament. That would prepaie the public mind to yield the 

 funds required for the removal of the evils which had been so 

 well poiuted cut by Mr. Clarke. He thought it was premature 

 at present to go to Parliament to ask for a Commission. The 

 public had been disgusted with the action of commissions 

 (Hear, hear), because many commissioners had proved utterly 

 unfit for the duties they undertook to perform ; and if a com- 

 miasiou were now appointed for the carrying out of im- 

 provements in arterial ilrainage, the lowering of mdl-dams, 

 and the compensation of millers, it might reasonably be ap- 

 prehended that these important duties would be entrusted to 

 raw ignorant and inefficient hands (Hear, hear). As (o Mr. 

 Baker's allusion to the contemplated reform of Parliament, 

 he did not believe any parliawent would ever entertain feelings 

 of hostility to the agriculiural interest. 



Mr. J. Howard (Bedford) said, although he frequently at- 

 tended the meetings of the Club, he seldom took part in the dis- 

 cussions, the subjects being generally of a purely agricultural cha- 

 racter ; but he thought that on a question of this kind those who 

 were engaged in piactical agriculture might fairly look for assist- 

 ance from those who were iu a different position. The whole 

 country, in fact, was deeply interested in arterial drainage. The 

 health of the entire district comprised in the valley of the 

 Ouse had been very seriously affected by the daraming-up of 

 that river. Far be it from him to advocate injustice to the 

 ownera and occupiers of mills on that river; and he thought 

 that if the suggestions of Mr. Clarke wera carried out, 

 such persons ought to be dealt with in a liberal spirit 

 (Hear, hear). Mr. Clarke had alluded to the injury done 

 by nr.ain drains, and parish drains or ditches, and he could 

 corroborate what fell from him on that subject. Uu to 

 about eight years ago, the village of Cople, near to where 

 he resided, was scarcely evtr free from typhus fever. At 

 that period the Duke of Bedford cut; a new ditch to drain 

 a portion of the parish, and since then theie had been 

 only one case of fever. He thought, therefore, that great im- 

 provement might be made iu the watercourses of various 

 parishes. He had himself witnessed the damage done to some 

 of the low-lying parts of his district by the overflowing of the 

 main ditches ; aud he particularly remembered that, two or 

 three years ago, the young wheats were flooded two or three 

 times before Christmas. There might be great difEculty iu 

 carrying out the improvements which Mr, Clarke advocated j 



but of this he felt quite certain, that if the work were left to 

 the localitiea themselves it would never be effected (Hear, 

 hear). 



Mr. Owen Wallis (Overstone Grange, Northampton) 

 said no one present could be more sensible than he was of the 

 utility of arterial drainage when properly conducted. There 

 could be no doubt that a great deal of laud suffered very ma- 

 terially for want of BUlllcient outfall, particularly laud which 

 lay immediately above the water-level of the large streams. 

 But if drainage was to be effected at the cost that had beeu 

 incurred in the valley of the Nene, of which he was unfor- 

 tunately a native and a resident, it had better be let alone. 

 There hundreds of thousands had been expended, hundreds of 

 thousands more would have to be expended, and he believed 

 there was not a proprietor in the valley who was sanguine enough 

 to expect ever to receive one shilling for bis pound. He did not 

 mean to say that the work had been improperly begun ; he knew 

 many of the gentlemen with whom the scheme originated, and 

 they were undoubtedly men of the highest character, actuated 

 by a desire to do good to the valley ; but a great mistake had 

 certainly been made, and he hoped it would be a lesson in all 

 future draining operations. Mistakes of that kiud did 

 more to retard t!ie work of drainage generally than any preju- ' 

 dice which had to be overcome. It was doubtful whether 

 many cases the draining of flooded land was so beneficial as 

 some persons supposed. He had occupied land which had been 

 only partially flooded, undoubtedly to its injury; but adjoining 

 laud that was deeply flooded had received great benefit : and 

 he knew other occupiers of land on the Nene, who feared that 

 if drainage were carried out to the extent proposed, the best 

 description of meadow-land would be materially injured by the 

 process. The great source of injury along the borders of the 

 various streams was unquestionably the mills. They heldup 

 the water ; and whenever there was an opportunity of raising 

 the weirs, it was seized, and thus the evil was increased. 

 There was, indeed, a law to protect those who were injured in 

 that way ; but the process was so disagreeable, that hardly 

 any one had recourse to it. In his own district there was a 

 fall of something like 160 feet between Wisbeach and North- 

 ampton, and yet they were paying an enormous sum for aa 

 outfall. 



Mr. C. E. Amos, (Consulting Engineer of the Royal Agri- 

 cultural Society,) said : Being a native of Lincolnshire, he 

 had had frequent opportunities of noticing the outfalls of 

 the rivers in that part of the country. It was quite clear 

 that a great evil existed, but it was not so clear v/hat was 

 tlie remedy. It would not be sufficient to overturn the 

 mills, because the present outfalls would not take away the 

 water, aud the expense of getting proper outfalls would be 

 too heavy to be borne by the district which received the 

 immediate benefit. The first requisites were to increase the 

 area, and to deepen and straighten the outfalls. But it 

 was impossible for the agricultural interest to bear a heavier 

 impost than it was doing already ; and if dr;iinage was to 

 be carried out effectually, it must be dealt with in a com- 

 prehensive manner. 



JMr. Clarke, in replying, observed that he gathered 

 from what had fallen from the different speeches that it 

 was the general opinion that the question was not yet suf- 

 ficiently ripe for any active step towards securing legislation, 

 but he should be happy to do anytliing in his power for the 

 diffusion of information. In illustration of the advantages 

 derivable from a general drainage Act, he stated that from 

 a return issued recently by the Inclosure Commissioners he 

 found that the total cost of proceedings in tweuty-two cases 

 of enclosure, embracing 6,000 acres of land, was £365, 

 showing an average of little more than £16. He hoped 

 that at no distant day they would be able to congratulate 

 each other on the attainment of a practical issue to that 

 discussion. 



On the motion of Mr. Gray, seconded by Mr. Skelton, a 

 vote of thanks was awarded to Mr. Clarke for his paper ; 

 and on the motion of Mr. Hoivard, seconded by Mr. 

 Wiltsher, it was resolved, 



" That the committee be requested to take into con- 

 sideration the question discussed that evening, at their next 

 monthly meeting." 



The proceedings terminated with a vote of thanks to the 

 Chairman, 



