Mnrch 10. 1918 



HARDWOOD RECORD 



21 



Hardwood Record Interviews Vehicle Makers 



Important Points Brought Out in Conversation with the Vehicle Committee and Col. W. S. Wood 

 of the United States Quartermaster's Department 



In the interest of progress in the work of pioiliieing the v.irious 



pes of war vehicles for the government and in an attemi)t to 



imiiiate misunJerstaniUngs which promise to retard such progress, 

 Uardwood Record sought and recently obtained an interview with 

 the wagon and vehicle purchasing committee through its chairman, 

 A. B. Thiclcus of South Bend. 



The interview took place at the Hotel La Salle, Chicago, on 



'liday, March 1. Those present were members of the wagon and 



■ hide purchasing committee, Col. W. S. Wood, in charge of vehicle 



iroduction for the United States Quartermaster's Department and 



E. H. Defebaugh, president of Hardwood Record. 



The following is a verbatim report of the conversation: 



Mr. Defebaugh inquired as to whether the government had made 

 1 contract with the wagon idustry to furnish so many wagons at 

 three different prices. 



Col. Wood: No. we made no contract with the w.ngon industry. We 

 made contracts only with the individual. Each man had a difToront price 

 ■1 competitive bids. This was for tile first contracts of about 10.000 in 

 xpril. 1917. After the first wagon contracts were given out, which, as I 

 iv, were entirely "" cnnipetitive buying and at difl'ercnt prices to different 

 luoplc, whijn the rctiuirenicnts of the government began to increase so 

 lively, it was realized by the War Department that in order to get them 

 out properly, and that the government should get its requirements filled. 

 the entire wagon industry must be lined up, as we did in the leather 

 industry, in the harness industry, and as we have done since then in 

 wheels, etc. In other words, my Idea is that in order to get the best 

 results to win this war successfully and quickly, the way to do is to make 

 all the industries as a body get right behind the government and push. 

 As far as I know, under my direction the Jeffersonvillc depot is the first 

 branch of the government, or first place, where an attempt was made 

 to organize the industry. I^ast April I got a letter from General Baker 

 In the office of the Quartermaster General, suggesting that it would be 

 wise to call an assembly of wagon makers at Jeffersonville In order to 

 talk over these thing with them. They came, some fifteen of them, and 

 from them I got such a clear idea of the entire wagon situation that I 

 made a full report on it to the Quartermaster General, and recommended 

 that they should have these gentlemen come on to Washington and talk 

 with them there. These gentlemen went there, and I went there, and at 

 that time there was formed what has since been known as the Wagon & 

 Vehicle Committee, which is an Advisory Committee only to the depot 

 -quartemiastcr at Jeffersonville. They have no executive authority what- 

 soever themselves, and anything that they do is by the authority and 

 under the responsil)ility of the depot quartermaster at Jeffersonville alone 

 as representative of the Quartermaster General in the War Department. 



The committee was composed of Mr. Board, Mr. Thieiens. Mr. Lea and 

 Mr. Parsonage. That committee was also recognized as a committee by 

 the Wagon & Vehicle Association. This committee was recognized by a 

 letter from the Quartermaster General in Washington, and also by a letter 

 from me as depot quartermaster. It became an official committee. Later 

 on, last December, I think, when Congress adjourned, they passed a bill 

 that all these committees, "dollar committees," as they called them, 

 should be abolished. This committee was also abolished, but Mr. Brookins 

 of the War Industry Board wrote a letter to Mr. Parsonage who, during 

 that time, had become an advisory member of the War Industry Board 

 on wood products, in which he asked him to form an advisory committee 

 for himself of this same board. This committee does not supply anything. 

 This committee is simply advisory to the depot quartermaster. 



Mr. Parsonage did form this committee. I retained It as my depot 

 committee at JefTersonvillo, and the Wagon and Vehicle Association re- 

 tained it again as their committee. 



Therefore, this committee Is officially recognized, first, starting from 

 the bottom up — by the Wagon & Vehicle -Vssociatlon ; second, it is the 

 Advisory Committee on matters pertaining to the purcliasc of wagons, 

 of the depot quartermaster ; third, it is recognized officially by the Quat 

 termaster General's office In Washington. And, fourth, it is a recognized 

 official committee by the War Industries Board. The personnel of this 

 committee has changed somewhat ; for instance, Mr. Lea has received 

 notification of his commission as a major, and reported for duty at Jeffer- 

 sonville to take charge of the wagon situation at that depot ; and, other 

 changes. 



Mr. Dcfchiiui/h: This committee then is not recognized as buyers of 

 lumber for the wagons that they contract for? 



Col. Wood: They do not contract for the wagons. The quartermaster 

 at Jeirers<invllle contracts with the individual wagon makers. 



j)/r. Ilc/rhiniiili: Tlie intimation in the correspondence with reference 

 to contracts was that this committee, as representing the government. 



perhaps not as plainly as that— Intimated that they were government 

 contracts, and that they had a right to make the price. They did not say 

 that they had the right to make a price, but they had Influence enough 

 with the men who bought lumber for these same wagons, to get them to 

 cancel contracts. 



Col. Wood: That is all balled up. 



Mr. Dcfcbaugl': 1'he wheel company at Memphis — 



Col. Wood: As the authorized representative of the quartermaster 

 general's office I have the duty imposed on me to buy these wagons. I 

 call on the commiltec to recommend to me what quantities. In their 

 opinion, what quantities of wagons the different manufacturers can make. 

 It is their business to find out — what is the organization ; what stock 

 " the different wagon makers have : what machinery they have, etc., so that 

 they can say to me such and such a firm can make, say 2,000 wagons. I 

 call on my committee to produce for me costs, etc., which will indicate 

 to me what is a fair price to pay the manufacturers for making the wagons. 

 These costs are based on labor, the cost of hardwood, and materials of all 

 kinds. I consider these costs, and if they look all right to me, I send them 

 on to the Quartermaster General's office with a recommendation of ac- 

 ceptance or rejection. The Quartermaster General's office passes them on 

 to the War Industries Board, where the price is either approved, or they 

 cut it down. Then I tell these wagon people that they must make so 

 many wagons at such and such a price, to be done at such a time, and 

 then I advise them, that in order that they can makes a fair profit, I am 

 going to try to hold the prices of different hardwoods at a certain maximum, 

 and I say to them, now, in buying your lumber you must not go above the 

 maximum because if you do you will begin to rocket the prices, and you 

 will make the cost of wagons go up so that they cannot be produced for 

 the government at the fixed price, therefore, you must keep under these 

 prices that I am trying to hold, and if you cannot get wood stock at these 

 prices, tell me. I will tell the committee, and we will try to tell you where 

 you can go and make arrangements to get it. 



Mr. Dcfebauiili : Who was consulted in making this basis of costs? 



Col. Wood: The committee procured these from various manufacturers 

 — from eight to twelve manufacturers. 



jlfc. Dcfrbauah: I am not talking about the wagons. I am talking about 

 the lumber going into the wagons. 



Col. Wood: Well, I should say that probably the different purchasers for 

 the manufacturers. 



Mr. Thieiens: Yes — and the market. 



Col. Wood: That these prices are right is clearly shown from the fact 

 that we have been able— or the manufacturers of the wagons have been 

 able up to this time to get all the lumber that they wanted at these prices, 

 and we anticipate that they will, right straight along, and if the price 

 of lumber is raised it will simply result in the government paying more 

 money than necessary for these wagons, and I do not propose to allow it. 



Mr. Defebaugh: There is more money involved in that material, in the 

 lumber, than any other material that goes into a wagon. 



Col. Wood: Xes. 



Mr. Defebaugh: We have several national associations, just about the 

 same as the wagon manufacturers. Why should not we be consulted in 

 the cost of our goods, which, as you know, has advanced as much as twenty 

 or thirty per cent? 



Col. Wood: Why are we able to get lumber at our prices? Are we made 

 a present of this lumber? Are these people so patriotic that they are turn- 

 ing out this lumber at a loss? I do not think a man is entitled to make 

 a profiteering profit, and if I find a man in any connection with this that I 

 know is making a profiteering profit, if I can put that man in jail I will 

 do it. 



• Now, I will go back again further. Wlien we started this thing it was a 

 small proposition of ten thousand wagons, which at that time was looked 

 upon as a big proposition. In the past ten months the thing has come 

 up so that fnim (he ten thousand wagons it represented in April, there Is 

 now practically 210,000 wagons, and here within the past month I have 

 told my loinmittee, and I have written to my executive officer at Jefferson- 

 ville that I believe the time had come when hereafter we should attempt the 

 same plans that I understand are being worked by the cantonment branch 

 and by the slilpbuilding branch. That is, to send for the representatives 

 of the different hardwood associations and put the burden on them. The 

 committee should not have to bear these burdens. Say to the associations 

 that you have got to produce, and put the responsibility right onto the as- 

 sociations, instead of making the committee bear the responsibility. 



Mr. Defebaugh: The argument has been whether or not this committee 

 can cancel a contract after making it. 



Col. Wood: The conmilttee makes absolutely no contracts whatsoever. 

 All contracts are made by the depot quartermaster at Jeffersonville. If you 

 refer to the placing orders for hardwood material, the committee cannot 

 cancel any onlers that are placed by manufacturers. Nor do I. That is 

 entirely a pirson.il matter between the manufacturer and the man from 



