HARDWOOD RECORD 



21 



gards poplar I am a little bit surprised the 

 way most of you here talk. In New York 

 state we had always supposed nearly every 

 one is better situated in regard to poplar 

 than ourselves and we let that market alone 

 as much as possible. Nevertheless, there is 

 some one shipping pojihir Cross Banding for 

 not to exceed $3. 



Mr. Groffman: .Just to keep the ball roll- 

 ing — relative to the logging situation 1 want 

 to say briefly that with the heavy rains we 

 liave had, especially in Missouri — and I 

 think they were general — it was next to 

 impossible to do anything in the way of 

 logging. We have found ourselves prac- 

 tically down and out; even with all the re- 

 sources we have we could not get in logs, 

 and we are just running from hand to mouth, 

 so to speak, and have no assurance we will 

 be able to get logs enough to keep us run- 

 ning. As to trade conditions we have found 

 it very quiet the last few weeks. We do 

 not know whether that applies to us alone 

 or not, and I should like to know whether 

 this lull is general. We are in hopes that 



L. r. GUOFF.MAX. DIltliCTOU. ST. 7,0UIS 

 BASKET & BOX CO., ST. LOUIS, MO. 



in the course of a few weeks, with a little 

 sunshine, we will have a general revival of 

 business, and I think if we do have it this 

 is the time to talk better prices. 



Mr. Underwood: I think the conditions 

 in these various localities are quite different. 

 Take the logging operations Mr. Groffman 

 refers to; where we operate in the South 

 the more rain we have the better. We are 

 just luxuriating in rain. Up North we can- 

 not do much. 



Mr. Lord: I do not like to talk twice on the 

 same subject, but there is one point in re- 

 gard to the general custom of making prices 

 each year. We have all done it. W-e have 

 all done a lot these buyers wanted us to do. 

 In fact they dictate very largely to the 

 millman as to what he shall do. And I 

 believe unless niillnien wake up and tell 

 buyers what they must do, we cannot put 



the veneer business on a good basis as com- 

 pared with theirs. The buyers want to .buy 

 for a year, but very few lumbermen can 

 buy logs that way. They have to take them 

 as they come and pay whatever is demanded 

 for them. I think we want to work along 

 the line of running our own affairs, and not 

 let buyers do it for us. 



Mr. Defebaugh: Has it not been true that 

 the veneer business up to this time has been 

 I'liaotic because you have not talked to 

 each other? The buyer has had you where 

 he wanted you, because there has not been 

 an exchange of ideas on these matters. Tell 

 each other what your stock is worth. Lots 

 of people don't ask more for theirs because 

 they are not in touch with you. One of 

 the strongest points in organization is to 

 show a man what he should ask for his 

 goods, and why. 



Some interesting discussion on prices fol- 

 lowed. 



Mr. Defebaugh then read the following 

 letter from an interested manufacturer: 



Mr. E. II. Defebaugh. Secretary the National 



Veneer & Panel Manufacturers' Association. 



Dear Sir: Undoubtedly we will , not be able 

 to attend the meeting in June on account of the 

 floods and continued wet weather. We are away 

 behind in our orders. 



Out of the demoralizing conditions of the 

 ■\'eneer trade just consider w'liat a jireat .imount 

 of good the recently printed market conditions 

 on the poplar rotary cut veneers has done. Lit- 

 tle did the poplar manufacturers realize their 

 strength when they joined the association. We 

 considered the real top market price was, at 

 that time, 50 cents to $4 per thousand' feet 

 higher than was printed, and if it had been 

 printed higher all would have been benefited 

 just that much more. This is certainly a real 

 live object lesson. It has been tried and we all 

 know it. If there are any manufacturers still 

 in the dark it is because they have not become 

 members of the association. Generally spealiiug. 

 what one sees in print is so. 



This also shows what great amount of good 

 a like treatment of all the other different va- 

 rieties of woods will do. 



There is no doubt but that the market will 

 stand an advance on all veneers and panels. 

 I'he association way is the only way for manu- 

 facturers to arrive at the true and proper 

 market conditions on all of their products. U 

 is now apparent that it is an absolute necessity 

 for veneer manufacturers to join the associa- 

 tion to protect themselves. The middle men 

 and the buyers are the ones that have caused 

 the demoralized conditions. 



All who are interested in their own future 

 welfare must all stand together and "stand 

 pat." 



In speaking of profits, when you take into 

 consideration that the timber supply is fast 

 disappearing, also the great risk one takes in 

 operating a mill, the manufacturer should earn 

 the price of his mill. viz.. the cost to date, 

 every four or live years as a profit to lay aside 

 lor a rainy day. Why not? No manufacturer 

 (.an afford to "do business on a lU per cent 

 margin, or even a 2U per cent. Just consider 

 the wear and tear on machine:-y and build- 

 ings : also that we are called upon often to put 

 in new and improved machines. What can you 

 sell a wornout manufacturing plant for. say, 

 after four to six years of running'.' What has 

 the average veneer man to show for his worn- 

 out plant and efforts at the end of a period of 

 six years'/ 



.\nother great trouble is that it looks as if a 

 great majority of veneer and panel manufac- 

 turers have never figured the real, true cost of 

 production. It seems to us that it would be 

 a very wise plan to have more figures along 

 the line of costs; also to have a revised printed 

 market condition on all the different %'arieties of 

 veneers and i)anels. with grading rules. 



We feel that the association has been a de- 

 cided success up to date. The future should 

 be even more so. 



With best wishes, we are, yours truly, 



AMBuiCAN Panel & Lumber Co, 



Mr, Defebaugh: The man who wrote this 

 has never been to these meetings. If we 

 can get a hundred other such fellows to come 



and help us, as well as themselves, to get 

 the most out of the business, we will have 

 accomplished a great deal, I think we are 

 making a mistake by not being more frank 

 on the subject of prices, and putting them in 

 such shape that you will help the other fel- 

 low to get in line. He will be low enough 

 all the time, do not worry about that. That 

 has always been the trouble. 



After further discussion of prices, upon 

 motion the convention adjourned to the 

 main dining room of the Auditorium where 

 a delightful luncheon was served. 



AFTERNOON SESSION, 



The meeting reconvened at 2:30 p. ni, 

 Mr, B, Anderson: I move that a paragraph 

 be printed on the grading rules providing 

 that all the dimensions shall be stated in 

 order of thickness, width across tha grain 

 and length, according to a resolution adopted 

 last year. 



The motion was seconded and carried, 

 Mr, Kline: Another matter to which your 

 attention is called is the instruction to the 

 Kxecutive Committee to emyjloy an assist- 



K. C. IiAVTON, WISCONSIN VENEEI! CO. 

 KHINELAXDER, WIS. 



ant secretary. No action has been taken 

 by them and if you have any further in- 

 structions to give will be pleased to hear 

 them. Is it your desire to allow the matter 

 to still remain in the hands of the Execu- 

 tive Committee? 



Mr. B. Anderson: I make that motion. 



On being seconded and put to vote the 

 motion prevailed. 



Mr. Kline: Mr. Roddis has promised to 

 tell us something about fire in a veneer 

 plant. 



On Insurance. 



Mr. Koddis: Gentlemen, I have not pre- 

 pared any address on this subject, but the 

 first thing that occurs to me is that every 

 veneer plant should be well insured. It 

 certainly is a dangerous business. The num- 

 ber of veneer plants burned out at one 

 time or another must be very nearly the to- 



