70 ORAL ARGUMENT OF HON. EDWARD J. PHELPS. 



Wellj what was the general statement — that there was an inter- 

 mingling or not? What are the observations and statements that it 

 referred to, except tlie proceedings of these cruisers and a very small 

 suggestion that they had enquired generally of sealers, followed by 

 the paragraph I alluded to just now, pointing out that sealers were very 

 reticent in speaking on the subject. 



Xow in 1891, when they were on the Commander Islands, they took 

 the testimony of a native long eni]doyed, named Snigeroff, and John 

 Malowanski acted as interpreter, Mr. Thomas Morgan being present. 

 This is copied from the United States Appendix, vol. 2, page 198: 



Suigeroff testified that he had lived on the Pribilof Islands for many years and 

 knew the distinctive characteristics of both heards, Commander and Pribilof and 

 their liabits, and that he removed from tlience to Behring Island. He pointed out 

 that the two heards have several diflereiit characteristics and stated that in his belief 

 they do not intermingle. 



That is one statement which these gentlemen have on the Islands; 

 and then Mr. Morgan on page 201 of the same book testifies that — 



Said Commissioners asked said Snigeroff the further question, whether he believed 

 that the Pribilof herd and the Komandorski herd ever mingled, and he replied that 

 he did not. 



We hear of no other statements to the British Commissioners what- 

 ever. 



Now, my learjied friends, or whoever had charge of the preparation 

 of the Counter Case, perceiving that to sustain the proposition that 

 these seals were such wild animals that they might be slain at pleasure 

 on the high seas, and that the United States had no right in them, it 

 was necessary to infringe in some way upon the great leading facts 

 which attach the animals to the Islands, select this point, and ibr the 

 first time they go into a considerable amount of testimony, from two 

 sources; one is from some London furriers, wholesale and retail, prin- 

 cipally retail I should think, of whom they have examined a consider- 

 able number, the other is from a body of sealers, men engaged in the 

 business of sealing. The one refers to the diiference between the skins 

 which we had originally proved and which was not at all contradicted by 

 the British Commissioner's Eeport — all the evidence that we had or they 

 had on the subject then was that they were completely distinguishable; 

 the other is from the men who claimed to have seen seals all over the 

 sea from west to east, and at all times intermingling — evidence, of course, 

 to which we had not a chance of reply. 



(Mr. Phelps proceeded to review critically all the evidence on both 

 sides bearing upon the question of the alleged intermingling of the 

 seals of the Pribyloft' Islands with those of the Commander Islands, 

 reading many iiassages from it, and claimed that so far from any such 

 intermingling being proved, the contrary was completely established. 



He pointed out that the fact had never been claimed in the whole 

 history of seal life until suggested by the British Commissioners in the 

 contradictory passages from their report before considered. That it 

 was denied by witnesses of the highest credit and fullest means of 

 knowledge, both Russian and American, who had been concerned in 

 the management of the Commander Islands, and of the Pribyloff 

 Islands, and was supported by no witness who had ever had any such 

 experience. 



That no witness was produced who claimed ever to have seen a Com- 

 mander Island seal on the Pribyloff Islands or a Pribyloff Island seal 

 on the Commander Islands. That the only evidence brought forward 

 to prove intermingling was from a body of men employed in the Cana- 



