Febmary 11, 1875. ] 



JOUENAL OF HORTICULTURE AND COTTAGE GARDENER. 



115 



Society in order to benefit themselves. Now, he wished to 

 address a few words to his brother Fellows, the " Kensing- 

 tonians." With great deference to the noble Chairman, he 

 could not but think, after reading the Report, that it did not 

 bear a pleasant aspect as regarded the Commission. He had 

 now nothing to do with the Commissioners— he might say in 

 the language of Shakespeare, " Our withers are uuwrung." 

 Since, however, they were in a great measure dependant upon 

 the Commission, he could not think it was wise to use terms 

 which appeared to him, he would not say oflonsive, but assuredly 

 not calculated to conciliate the Commissioners [hear, hear]. 

 He was not finding fault with the Council. He thought that 

 nieetiug ought to be good enough to authorise the Council to 

 consider some of the sentences in the Report, and either to omit 

 these sentences or recast them [hear, hear]. That would not 

 be the slightest reflection upon the Council of the Society. He 

 ehould also suggest that after reconsidering their Report the 

 Council should take steps to establish their own legality 

 [cheers]. 



Mr. Shirley Hibberd felt that there were so many unsatis- 

 factory passages in the Report, and the Society appeared to be 

 in such an uufortunate position, and the Coimcil seemed to be 

 so entirely destitute of a policy, that he should move that the 

 Report be referred back to the Council for reconsideration. He 

 would point out one clause in this Report which they could not 

 aUow to pass after what the Chairman said as to what had 

 sprung up between the two authorities. It was impossible for 

 them to be on friendly terms, or even on proper business terms, 

 with Her Majesty's Commissioners, when they had in their 

 Report a paragraph which told them that Her Majesty's Com- 

 missioners attempted to get the lease voided, so that the Society 

 should be cast upon their mercy to receive some dole. The jar 

 was upon the whole of the proceedings that day, and there 

 appeared to be no other course open than to ask the Council to 

 take the Report back, read it through, and consider it. He 

 begged to move as an amendment that the Report be referred 

 back to the Council for reconsideration. 



Dr. Denny said, that considering the way in which the Chair- 

 man spoke, and the conciliatory way in which he mentioned 

 Her Majesty's Commissioners, he (Dr. Denny) looked upon the 

 Report as one of the least possible taste, and besides as being 

 untrue [cries of oh! and hear]. They had no right to say 

 that Her Majesty's Commissioners intended to take away 

 from them their lease. They seemed to forget that if the lease 

 was voided it was voided by themselves, and not by the Com- 

 missioners [hear, hear], and simply because they did not pay 

 their rent to the Commissioners. The Report alleged what 

 was not true ; and as it was impossible for them to pass the 

 Report as it stood, he had much pleasure in seconding the | 

 amendment moved by Mr. Shirley Hibberd. They were told | 

 they were to save £2.500 next year. What was it to be saved 

 out of ? Was it not to be saved out of horticulture and out of 

 shows ? He did not find fault with South Kensington interests, 

 for they had a right to be represented, but they had not a right 

 to swamp every man. The President was a South Kensing- 

 tonian,the Vice-President was a South Kensingtonian [laughter] 

 The Treasurer was a South Kensingtonian [more laughter], the 

 Secretary was a South Kensingtonian, the Finance Committee 

 were composed entirely of South Kensingtonians, and those out- 

 side South Kensington had not a voice in the matter at all 

 [laughter]. He should like to know how they were going to pay 

 their rent next year. If they were going to do it they ought to do 

 it a'j once, and not leave it until Her Majesty's Commissioners 

 chose to take proceedings against the Society. If they could not 

 meet their expenditure they ought to take means to do so. 

 It would be far better to propose to the wealthy Fellows of South 

 Kensington to put their hands in their pockets and pay off the 

 debentures. There were, say, a thousand very rich people in 

 South Kensington, and it would only cost about £17 each to pay 

 it all off [question, question]. Well, it would be better to do that 

 than to go begging for what they had no right to, and nothing 

 whatever to do with. They ought to know with regard to horti- 

 culture, what it was proposed to take off and what it was pro- 

 posed to put on. Everything should be given up before they 

 touched their staff. Had they a right to ask gentlemen whose 

 time was valuable to give it to the Society, and to pay a con- 

 siderable amount for railway fares, whilst the lawyer they em- 

 ployed would not do his work for nothing ? 



The CnAiiiM.iN — What are you alluding to ? 



Dr. Dennv. — To your scientific staff. 



The Chairman. — What do you say about the Council ? 



Dr. Denny. — I am alluding to your scientific staff. 



The Chairman. — All the members of the Council are unpaid. 



Dr. Denny. — I am quite aware you are unpaid. Next year 

 when they would not be able to pay their rent, they would find 

 horticulture would drop down to nothing. 



Mr. Haughton congratulated the Chairman upon the speech 

 he had made, the more so because it appeared to be a total 

 reversal of the policy hitherto pursued, and because that at the 

 last moment they had ceased to wage war against Her Majesty's 



Commissioners, and that practically a treaty of peace had 

 been entered into [ hear, and cheers.] He had hoped to have 

 heard something more of the details of the treaty. He had 

 hoped to have heard something more of the real state of the 

 Society, and of the loss which had accrued to it in consequence 

 of ill-advised warfare. On both points they had had nothing 

 but promises. He was told they were to have a great reduction in 

 expenditure nest year, but how that reduction was to be effected 

 they were not told. No estimate had been laid before them — 

 nothing but a bare statement. He thought it must be obvious to 

 everyone in that room that a reduction must be effected if they 

 were not to forfeit their lease or be turned out of their Gardens. 

 Mr. Haughton then went through the accounts submitted by the 

 Council, and, having shown what he considered their bankrupt 

 position, said that the Council should pause before they went 

 to open war with the Commissioners, and should ascertain what 

 their position really was, and see whether the Commissioners 

 were acting rightly or wrongly. It was most desirable that 

 amicable and friendly arrangements should be made with Her 

 Majesty's Commissioners, and that when that was accomplished 

 the result should be announced to the Fellows. He thought the 

 concluding words in the Report ought to be struck out, and if 

 they were not he should support the amendment. 



Mr. Quilter, as a country member, was anxious to see some 

 amicable arrangement come to, so as to end this continued strife 

 [hear, hear]. He should be sorry to see the Gardens done away 

 with, but there were many ways in which they could be helped, 

 just as the Prince Consort wished to help them. 



After a few words from Sir Alfred Slade, correcting some 

 figures quoted by Mr. Haughton, 



Mr. EDG.UR BowRiNG said he should speak as a member of 

 the Royal Horticultural Society, and not as a member of the 

 Royal Commission. He had listened with much pleasure to the 

 speech of the Chairman, and with the Chairman he trusted 

 that some amicable arrangement would be come to between the 

 two bodies. He completely endorsed the remarks of Sir Henry 

 Tring [cheers]. He did not think the Royal Commissioners 

 would show any hostility whatever to the Council, but that, on 

 the contrary, the desire of the Commissioners was to exhibit 

 goodwill and friendship towards the Council [cheers]. He 

 should support the amendment that the Report be sent back to 

 the Council for reconsideration. He could only say that he 

 hoped the result of the meeting would be that the present 

 Council would be declared to be legally appointed. It was be- 

 cause of the opinion expressed by the law officers of the Crowe 

 that the Expenses Committee on the part of the Commissioners 

 had not met ; and he mit;ht say that the question of the skating 

 rink was outside the functions of the Expenses Committee 

 altogether. 



The Chairman. — I asked the meeting not to sanction, but to 

 discuss the question. 



Mk. Bowiung. — I should not have done so — I should have 

 referred it to the Royal Commissioners. The Commissioners 

 had full power under the Act. On the whole it seemed to him 

 better to refer the Report back to the Council. 



The Chairman. — It may save the time of the Fellows if I at 

 once state the course the Council feel it their duty to pursue in 

 this matter. I do, in the first place, entreat you to put a little 

 trust in the Council which has carried on your affairs during the 

 last two years. We have, with the greatest possible satisfaction, 

 two announcements from the Commissioners — first, that it is not 

 their intention to build on the Gardens. Now, we accept that aa 

 a most gratifying fact [cheers], and I will not state the evidence 

 on which we thought otherwise. We are glad of it. Another 

 gratifying fact is that the Royal Commissioners do not intend 

 in any hostile sense to determine our lease, or to attempt to do 

 so, and we accept that statement as frankly as it is given, and 

 with very sincere delight, However, gentlemen, if this meeting 

 were to come to a resolution that this Report was to be sent 

 back, what would happen ? The Council of course would resign. 

 Speaking personally I could not fill a more thankless office ; but, 

 speaking as a member of the Society, and looking to the welfare 

 of the Society, I should be sorry if at this moment you should 

 turn out your Council [no, no]. I tell you the reason why. 

 If you tell us to take back our Report, of course we resign ; but 

 it would be churlish, as this is the first time we have been met 

 by the Royal Commissioners in a friendly spirit, to say we would 

 not adjourn our meeting to look at our Report, so as to arrive 

 at some solution which would be amicable [loud cheers]. If 

 you put this amendment to the vote, we will be bound in 

 honour, at this moment to stand by this Report, and you know 

 it. I ask you not to put us in this embarrassing position. 



Mr. Godson. — I move the adjournment of the debate to this 

 day month. 



Mr. Haughton. — I beg to second that. 



Mr. Shikley Hibberd. — Then under the circumstances I shall 

 withdraw my amendment with great pleasure [hear, hear]. 



The motion for adjournment to the second Tuesday in March 

 was then put and carried, and a vote of thanks to the Chairman 

 closed the protracted proceedings. 



