Fobrnary 12, 1S71 ] 



JOURNAL OP HGRTICULTOBE AND COTTAGE GARDENER. 



141 



TliB Chairman. — We must, I suppose, accept the disclaimer of 

 the Royal Commissioners. At the same time you know the affairs 

 and finances of the Society are not in a very flourishing con- 

 dition, and if you get into Chancery where are the funds to come 

 Irom ? Tliat is all I say [applause]. 



Mr. DoBRKE (Treasurer) said he went to the Albert Hall to see 

 Mr. Richards, and having waited some time was asked his busi- 

 ness. He said he had come to see Mr. Richards on horticultural 

 matters, and that he was the Treasurer of the Society. The 

 person bespoke to looked at him and said, " Do you want to 

 inow what they are doing? [laughter]. They have taken 

 another opinion," he said, " and they are going to send out 

 another opinion with the circular. They have taken another 

 opinion from Sir G. Jessel, and Sir Daniel Cooper is going to 

 send it out with a circular" [laughter]. Therefore he (Mr. 

 Dobree) contended that the circular was sent out on the au- 

 thority of the Royal Commissioners [hear and no]. 



Mr. Shirlet Hibdebd said the promoters of the amendment 

 had not provided the Society with the means of going to law. 

 It was absurd to talk about going to the Court of Chancery. 

 Did the gentlemen know what a Chancery suit would cost ? 

 [hear, hear]. Did he wish to break his own or their hearts and 

 spend every shilling they got, and in the end to be as wise as 

 they then were ? The Commissioners had transacted business 

 ■with the Council and the Council with the Commissioners, and 

 if the Commissioners could recognise the Council when it suited 

 them they must also recognise the Council when it suited the 

 latter [laughter and cheers]. Who were the men now opposing 

 the Council ? Those who invited them to come in ten months 

 ago [no, no]. The men who had brought them into a thousand 

 difficulties had been plotting against them. He thought they 

 ought to support their Council, so that something like a sensible 

 arrangement might be made with the Commissioners. That 

 •was the principal business before them [hear, hear]. 



Mr. LiGGiNs observed that it was then past four o'clock, and 

 they had no longer power to continue the ballot. 



The Chairman announced that the list recommended by the 

 Council had been unanimously adopted. It was as follows ; — 

 Extraordinary vacancies. — Vacating members, H.R.H. Prince 

 Arthur, H.S.H. Duke of Teok, Lord Londesborough, and Mr. 

 Andrew Murray. Fellows proposed by the Council to fill up the 

 vacancies, Lieut. -Gen. Hon. Sir A. H. Gordon, K.C.B., Mr. Joseph 

 Robert Tritton, Mr. Burnley Hume, and Mr. H. Webb. Officers ; 

 —President, Viscount Bury. Treasurer, Mr. Bonamy Dobree. 

 Secretary, Mr. W. A. Lindsay. Expenses Committeemen, Sir 

 Alfred Slade, Bart., Mr. W. A. Lindsay, Mr. H. Little. Auditors, 

 Mr. James Nicholson, Mr. J. Gibson, and Mr. R. Hudson, F.R.S. 



Mr. LiGGiNS said therefore there was no doubt now the Coun- 

 cil were legally elected [hear, and laughter]. They had now a 

 legal right to sit and work with diligence and activity to carry 

 out the best interests of the Society. Their very first effort 

 should be to break down the clique headed by Major General 

 Scott, Mr. Bateman, Mr. Cole, and Lord Alfred Churchill, who 

 had circulated among the Fellows such papers as were seen in 

 the room that day. If it went forth that the Society was going 

 into Chancery, people would not join it [hear, hear]. They 

 should support the present Council. Why, if these gentlemen 

 thought they had the shadow of a chance of electing their own 

 Bet did they not do so at that moment ? He thought it was 

 monstrous that Mr. Richards, an old servant of the Society, who 

 was greatly respected, should betray them in such a way. Let 

 them support the Council and the President, who did not neglect 

 4he business as the late President did. 



Lord A. Churchill remarked that the meeting had just 

 elected four additional members of Council more than were pro- 

 jrided for by the Charter. He maintained that there were no 

 Tracancies. 



The Chairman said the Council were acting under legal 

 jidvice. * 



Lord A. Churchill. — Well, the amendment was for a friendly 

 reference to the Court of Chancery to decide the dispute. There 

 ■were strong legal opinions on both sides of the question. Sir 

 George Jessel gave it as his opinion that the old Council still 

 existed, and as one of the old Council he felt in an uncomfort- 

 able position, because, as certain gentlemen were spending the 

 money of the Society, he did not know but some day or other 

 the money would be run through, that the debenture interest 

 ■would not be paid, and that then the debenture-holders would 

 come upon the old Council for the money which had been spent 

 [no, and laughter]. It was perfectly reasonable that the meet- 

 ing should now agree to a friendly reference [no, no]. Ifitwere 

 decided that the present Council were the legal occupiers of the 

 office he would give them all the support he could, but if not 

 the old Council must return. It was a question of law, and if 

 handled in a friendly way could be decided without any expense 

 at all. 



A Provincial Fellow said there was a strong feeling in the 

 country about the withdrawals of the Saturday tickets. 



Sir A. Slade said that as to the Fellows' orders on Saturdays 

 and the Is. charge, the present arrangement would last for 



one year. Many persons would come to the gardens when the 

 admission was Is. Oftentimes five hundred orders came in, but 

 not a shilling in money. 



A Country Fellow. — We look upon it as a breach of faith. 



Mr. Lindsay (Hon. Sec). — It is the desire of the Council to 

 make the gardens more popular with the public on holidays. 

 Every Fellow received, or ought to have received, a table of his 

 privileges previous to paying his subscription. 



Mr. BowBiNG, as a Royal Commissioner, wished to state that 

 neither he nor any other member of the Commission had any- 

 thing to say to the issue of the circular referred to. He held 

 the office of Treasurer to the Commission, and it was his duty 

 to receive X'210<J from the Horticultural Society which had never 

 reached him [a laugh]. He had only i'lOOO handed over to him, 

 which showed an alarming deficit. He was a life member and 

 debenture-holder of the Horticultural Society, and no person 

 could take greater interest in the gardens than he did. He had 

 served for many years as honorary secretary of the Expenses 

 Committee, and this would show he had a strong personal in- 

 terest in the welfare of the Society. He wished, however, to 

 say he was the only survivor of three indi-viduals whose duty it 

 was to bring about the existing arrangement between the two 

 bodies. These were the late Prince Consort, Mr. Coulson, and 

 himself. The Commissioners spent no less that ^5.5,000 in the 

 arcades, and they added two sums of ^£13,000 and £10,(X)0, which 

 made i.'78,000 expended in promoting the interests of the Horti- 

 cultural Society. Had they acted as ordinary landlords and 

 tenants they would have had to receive a large sum of money, 

 but the only sum they received for property worth some i!300,000 

 was i'516 15s. 9d. The Commissioners had received nothing by 

 way of rental, but by way of interest. He thought it a grave 

 question whether the lease of the Society had not already 

 fallen through [oh] . In two years from the present time, if thera 

 should be no payment of rent, the real question would be whether 

 the forfeiture of the lease would not arise. The debentures of tha 

 Society could not be worth a single farthing, and the Commis- 

 sioners would distrain on every article — the arcades, the conser- 

 vatories [no, no], the trees, and the shrubberies, which were 

 also distinctly specified as being forfeited to the Commissioners 

 in case the rent were not paid. That was a very serious matter 

 [hear, hear]. He deeply regretted that the Council should have 

 placed themselves in hostility to Her Majesty's Commissioners, 

 but when he saw the extraordinary step taken by the present 

 Council when the Commissioners made arrangements for letting 

 on lease a certain amount of their land, he was astonished. In- 

 stead of going to Her Majesty or the Home Office, the Council 

 petitioned the two Houses of Parliament to prevent the Com- 

 missioners doing the very thing they had the power by their 

 Charter to do. And four out of the five reasons they laid before 

 Parliament were reasons which applied equally to the great 

 national buildings about the gardens as to private buildings. 

 The late Prince Consort would never have allowed this agree- 

 ment to have been entered into unless with the understandinf; 

 that the gardens should be surrounded with buildings. He 

 hoped the meeting would agree to the amendment [no, no]. 

 One of the last meetings of the Commissioners took place at Marl- 

 borough House, under the presidency of H.R.H. Prince of WaleP, 

 and then they had the opinion of Sir G. Jessel telling them that 

 the present Council was not legally elected. Under that it was 

 impossible for the Commissioners to ratify any agreement with 

 a Council not legally elected. He had moved that the whole of 

 the recommendations with the exception of this one should be 

 adopted, it was seconded by the Duke of Edinburgh and passed ; 

 and so much for acting in hostility to the Society. 



Mr. W. A. Lindsay (Secretary), remarked that the Com- 

 missioners had refused to pay the Society ^£1013 due to it. In 

 1872 the late Council made a mistake by paying £1200 to the 

 Commissioners on the understanding that if it was found 

 there was not a sufficient surplus to pay the rent it should be 

 refunded, but it had not been [hear, hear]. As to the Com- 

 missioners refusing to ratify the arrangement, it was not a 

 matter for the Council, as the Board of Management repre- 

 sented the Commissioners. The fact was, that Mr. Cole objected 

 to deal with them unless they were empowered by the Council 

 to deal ■with him, and stated that he and Dr. Lyon Playfair had 

 power to negotiate. If the Committee of Management chose 

 to repudiate Mr. Cole's action on that occasion, Mr. Cole ought 

 to have resigned his appointment. When he referred to tha 

 fact that upon one occasion the late Council expended £500 

 upon a statue, he asked whether that was a proper way to ad- 

 minister the funds of the Society ? There never was bo careful 

 a statement of accounts as that presented this year, and there 

 never was a Council which tried more assiduously to forward 

 the interests of the Society [hear, hear]. As to the amend- 

 ment, they were quite certain the Council had been rightly 

 elected, but if it was the desire of the Commissioners to institute 

 a suit against them they could do so. It was evident a large 

 majority were in favour of the course proposed by the Council 

 [hear, hear]. 



Mr. BATEiLiN, with reference to Mr. Bowring's remarks, said 



