Deoembei IG, 1S7S. ] 



JOURNAL OF HOBTICUIiTUaS AND COTTAGE GAIiDENER. 



33?- 



Mr. GuED.\LLA said he wished to observe that the increase of 

 Bnbscribers could be only brought about by increased attracfious 

 [loud cries of " hear "J The great success of the Chiswick Gar- 

 dens was brought by the splendid breakfasts [great laughter]. 

 Oh, yes, he repeated that it was the breakfasts made the whole 

 thing a success [renewed laughter]. Well, if gentlemen laughed 

 he should like to ask how the Botanical Gardens were made a 

 success? Was it not by the lirne light [laughter], yes, and 

 other very great attractions '? [hear, henr]. Well, now, they 

 were threatened with an aquarium and other attractions which 

 suited all modern requirements and all the wants of the present 

 very-much-changed state of society [laughter]. Well, then, 

 what should the Royal Horticultural Society do ? Should it 

 not, as was generally said and accepted, do if it went into Rome 

 as Rome does? [hear, and dissent]. Now, one of the plans 

 spoken of frequently to the Fellows of the Society was the 

 establishment of a skating rink [cheers]. Well, Irom what he 

 had heard he had to take rather a melancholy view of the sub- 

 ject [a laugh]. He knew very well that the establishment of 

 a skating rink would be a source of greatly-increased revenue 

 to the Society. Well, had the shows increased ? If they had 

 it was on the scale of an Irish increase — an increase the other 

 way [laughter]. Respecting the privileges of the Fellows, no 

 doubt: there were many, and, as far as they went, valuable ones, 

 but there could be no doubt that there was a very considerable 

 difference of opinion with respect to the new resolutions which 

 the Council had proposed [cheers, and cries of "no"]. The 

 chief thing spoken of by the noble lord in the chair was 

 the abuse of entrance fees, or rather the abuse of trans- 

 ferable tickets, and he (Mr. Guedalla) did not believe that a 

 curtailment of this privilege would bring about a decrease of 

 the abase if it existed [hear, hear]. His own experience was 

 that with respect to this matter he had not used orders at all. 

 Indeed he had carefully avoided making use of the privilege 

 [hear, hear]. In conclusion of his speech Mr. Guedalla asked 

 the members to be united — to act with one aim and object — the 

 promotion of horticulture and the continued and improved ex- 

 istence of the Royal Horticultural Society, and he emphatically 

 stated that if this were done petty and miserable jealousies 

 and differences would sink, and the Society become, what it was 

 not now, a great national institution [loud cheers]. 



Lord AiFBED Churchill said he felt very much indebted to 

 his noble friend in the chair for the observations he had made, 

 but he wished to say he did not think the Council would be able 

 to raise by their scheme the income of the Society, and neither 

 did he think that the proposals of the Council were applicable to 

 the great majority of the Fellows. He did not go with the Coun- 

 cil that there had been an abuse in the transfer of tickets [loud 

 cries of "hear," and counter cries of "yes"]. If the Council 

 would not treat the Society in a liberal manner, by all means let 

 the Fellows pay for what they got, but let the Fellows at the 

 same time maintain their privileges, and have the power to 

 transfer tickets to friends whom they think proper to have ad- 

 mitted to the gardens [cheers]. He felt certain that unless the 

 Society gave greater facilities and privileges to members they 

 could not by any means raise their income to i'10,000 a-year. 

 Of course the Society could increase their receipts by diminish- 

 ing their expenditure [a laugh]. But then the question was, 

 Did any means exist by which the expenditure could be reduced ? 

 [hear, hear]. The cost of the gardens had gone on increasing, 

 and it should be borne in mind that the cost of their mainte- 

 nance was not taken into account [hear, hear]. Indeed, as most 

 of the Fellows knew, it was not taken into account at all. And 

 after all it was the great cost resulting from the management of 

 the gardens which had affected and brought the Society into its 

 present position [cheers, and a cry of "no"]. At any rate, his 

 lordship believed that the true interests of horticulture would be 

 promoted by the severance of the horticultural element from 

 South Kensington gardens ["no" and "yes"]. He could not 

 and he would not believe in these gardens being converted into 

 bricks and mortar for the benefit and at the will of the Com- 

 missioners [loud cheers]. With regard to the Horticultural 

 Society he believed if they only went back to their old quarters 

 at Chiswick— he should indeed say their original quarters at 

 Chiswick — would certainly bring about a better state of feeling 

 amongst horticulturists, and a bright future for the Society. 

 There was really a noble love for horticulture in the people of 

 this country. People saw that in the number of growiug so- 

 cieties, but these bad no cohesion in them, or rather among each 

 other. Well, one thing he should suggest was that a system of 

 lecturing on the principles and the science of horticulture should 

 be adopted [hear, hear]. The Society ought, by means of cor- 

 respondence, have itself in communication with the horticul- 

 tural societies of the Continent. Indeed, even from America and 

 Australia the Society ought to be able to have, if its correspon- 

 dence were properly carried on, a large amount — indeed, a very 

 large and important amount, of continental and American news. 

 He should just like to remark that he should thJDk it was ad- 

 visable to come to some decision as to the alteration of the 

 Charter. He should not at the present time trouble thtm with any 



schemes of his own, but, he might sincerely say — and he knew 

 all the Fellows present believed him— that he had the real in- 

 terests of the Society at heart. He thought, aud he said it with 

 great respect for the Council, that if they to; k back their pro- 

 posals aud reconsidered them, he doubted not an agreeable 

 method for solving their difticuUy and saving the Society would 

 be amicably ariived at [cheers]. If the propositions of th© 

 Council were adopted the Charter would have to be altered, 

 and at the same time horticulture would have to be practically 

 abandoned [" hear, hear," and cries of " no, nu" [. Lord Alfred 

 Churchill concluded in the following words: I thiok if the 

 Council would take back their proposals and reconsider them, 

 I doubt not that we shall come to the adoplim of a more agree- 

 able method likely to benefit the Society [npflause]. 



Mr. LioGixs said ho disagreeil in tuto with the propositions of 

 the Council, which ho thought would do the Society more- 

 damage than probably they ever expected to receive [a laugh]. 

 He had never heard a statement which more surprised him than 

 that of Admiral Hornby made at the last meeting. And for 

 tbis reason that be (Mr. Liggins) being a resident of Keneingtor:, 

 for fifty years claimed to know the ff-eling of Kensington, and 

 he was therefore quite surprised to hear Admiral Hornby's 

 opinion — that was the opinion of a perfectly new member lead- 

 ing them into a fog [laughter]. It was stuted by the Admiral 

 that the most disastrous results would occur, not to the Councii 

 alone, tut to the whole body of the Fellows. 



The President. — Was that a statement made at the present 

 meeting ? 



Mr. Liggins. — No, it was a statement made at a former 

 meeting. 



The President. — Ob, then, it was not on the present occasion, 

 so please don't refer to it [hear, hear]. 



Mr. Liggins. — Well, I will shorten my remarks, and I say I 

 am not going to he shunted out of the Royal Horticultural 

 Society [much laughter]. Iclaim the right to my own privileges 

 [loud cries of " heiir "]. As an old four-guinea Fellow I do not 

 think the Council have any right to touch my privileges [loud 

 cheers]. I have alwHys enjoyed a transferable ticket. Well, 

 are my wife and my daughter not to we it ? [cheers and counter 

 cheers]. I think a gentleman says " No." Well, if not it would 

 be a perfect waste of money to throw it away upon subscriptions 

 to the Royal Horticultural Society [hear, hear]. From conver- 

 sations I have had with many Fellows of the Society I find that 

 a general feeling prevails that they, as a body, are determined- 

 not to give up their privilege of being possessed of transferable 

 tickets [cheers]. I hope I express the feeling of the meeting 

 [cheers aud dissent]. We are all anxious to raise the income 

 of the Society. 



The President. — How ? [loud cheers and laughter]. 



Mr. Liggins. — It is not fur me to dictate to the Council ["oh," 

 laughter, and cheers]. Mr. Liggins went on to say that he 

 thought there would be no difficulty in the Crauncil raising Vae 

 income of the Society ; but if the Council wanted to increase 

 the revenue of the Society it must be done by means of increased 

 facilities at reduced cost. It was a perfectly backward move- 

 ment to take away the privilegf s of the Fellows ; and more than 

 that, he felt perfectly certain the Fellows would not submit to 

 it [cheers and laughter]. He hoped the Fellows would not 

 staud upon the subject of the resources of the Society, but 

 would stand as men, and continue to be Fellows of this tine old 

 Society [cheers]. Speaking of the question of transferable 

 tickets Mr. Liggins said it was not a very pleasant thing to 

 be told that Fellows had been mis-using tickets, and were dis- 

 honourably doing so. 



The President- — Nothing was said about dishonour. 



Mr. Liggins. — The word " dishonour " may not have been- 

 used, but the language of the noble Chairman was rather harsh. 



The President. — I must say I do consider it an abuse when 

 the members of another household are enabled to visit the 

 gardens by the use cf the name, or rather the ticket of a Fellow 

 of the Society [loud and prolonged cheers]. 



Mr. Liggins. — That is quite my view [cheers and laughter]. 



The President. — Now, that abuse exists very largely. It 

 does not exist as far as I am personally concerned, although I 

 am a four-guinea Fellow, but I think it is really discreditable 

 to those who practise that abuse [cheers]. 



Mr. Liggins — It is utterly hopeless, or at any rate anything 

 like probable, for us to raise in the four or five years our income 

 to £'10,000 without giving greater facilities to the Fellows. If we 

 could get a skating rink constructed, there is a fine piece of 

 ground which is not wanted at all at the corner of the gardens. 



The President then in answer to Lord Bury, said thut it had 

 been submitted to him by members of the Council, that to their 

 own knowledge the practice of transferring tickets existed, and 

 he assured his friend that he (the President) was not taking any 

 personal interest in the matter. 



After a short dlECussion in which Lord Bury distinctly chal- 

 lenged any person to show, or give any proof, how the power of 

 transferring tickets was abused, 



Admiral Hornby (CLuncil) said — Now the noble lord com- 



