192 



NOTES AND QUERIES. 



[2»* S. IX. Mah. 17. '60. 



king for playnly'denying hym his suyt whearby he saved 

 much charge & labour. 



"3 November 1610 



" An answer to y° king framed and offred by S r Mau- 

 rice Barkle}', w ch being read was disliked as too [cere- 

 monious & complementical & not real & actual] ? 



" The answer was to excuse our slowness by want of 

 eopetet number. 



" And that if our demands be granted, & no more shall 

 be imposed upo the land, his ma'J shall p'ceave that wee 

 now are as constant to p'sever in the contract as wee were 

 forward to undertake it. 



" S r Roger Owen divers things to be p'vided for other- 

 wise he was unwilling the contract should proceed. 



■' 1 Our security to be p'vided for by a full answer to 

 our grievances, no gap to be left open for the king to 

 impose upo his sub 4 ' 



" 2 meanes to levy it to be such as it may be leaste 

 burdensoe to the subiect 



" 3 p'vision to be made that this 200,000£ be not dob- 

 led nor trebled by inhansing of the eoyne by the king 



" p'vision that the explanacio of doubts_ may be by 

 parliamt. And that wee may have parliamts hereafter 

 thoe the kings wants be fully supplied 



" He sayd that the revenues of the Abbeys dissolved 

 according to the old rents was but 133,000£ and he 

 vouched Br Jewell for it 



" 5 provisio that this 200,000,6 may not be alienated 

 from the crowne. 



" 5 Novemb r 



" A message ly his ma'? ly the speaker. 



" His ma'y having by his speech in p'so upo inst & 

 apparant reasons drawne fro his necessities requyred 

 our resolutio concerning the contract thinks fit to omitt 

 nothing that may further our p'ceeding w th out mis- 

 taking or losse of tyme; he is pleased to represent unto 

 us the cleere mirrour of his bard & to sett before us the 

 essential parts of the contract lest the taking of things 

 by partes might induce any oblivion or distractio in the 

 contemplatio of the whole. 



" 1 He declareth that it never was his Intentio much 

 less his agreement to proceed fynally w th the contract 

 except he might have as well supplie as support to dis- 

 ingage hymself fro his debts. In reason his debts must 

 be first payd. His first demande for the supplie of his 

 wants and after the poynt of tenures &.- the distinctio of 

 support & supplie came in by our motio for his supplie he 

 expected to receave 500,000£ thoe it be Jesse then will 

 pay his debts & sett him cleere. 



" The subsidy & 15 th last given not to be taken as p' of 

 that somme by reaso of his great charge since for the 

 safety & honor of the state & the increase of his wants. 

 He desyreth to knowe our meanings clearly what wee 

 meane to doe in the supplie. 



" 2 Upon what natures the support may be raysed his 

 purpose is that it may be certayne firme & stable w th out 

 the meaner sorte, & w lh out diminutio of his present profit 

 The recompence of the present officers to p'ceed fro us but 

 not fro his ma'J w ch is no great matter considering it de- 

 pends upo theyre lives, and that it is not warranted by 

 the clause w ch gives us power to add or diminish because 

 it takes p'ffitt fro his ma'J'. And therefore he expects 

 200,000£ de claro." 



Some parts of this speech are not very clear. 

 They may, however, be easily explained by refer- 

 ring to former or subsequent discussions. When 

 James is said to have demanded that the support 

 should be " certain, firm, and stable, without the 

 meaner sort," these last words, which are written 



as an interlineation, where there was not room to 

 express all that the writer remembered, evidently 

 refer to a refusal to accept the proffered sum 

 except the whole of it should be raised from the 

 land, so as to be stable, and not to press upon the 

 " meaner sort." 



The last sentence is a misinterpretation of a 

 promise of the Commons, that they would not 

 claim any additional concession which should de- 

 rogate from the King's honour or profit. James 

 treats the demand that he should pension the 

 officers who would lose their employment, as a 

 new demand derogating from his honour or profit. 



Even if the House of Commons had yielded in 

 these particulars, the proposal that he should only 

 fulfil his part if the Commons granted him 

 500,000?. down, in addition to the annual grant 

 of 200,000/. was plainly a breach of the contract, 

 which throws the onus of the quarrel upon the 

 King. 



The MS. proceeds as follows : — 

 " 6 Nov. 1610. 



" S r Hierome Horsey moved that wee might meete w ,h 

 the L d * to acquaint, theyme w' h this message and to de- 

 syre theyme to conferre it w th the kings letter sent to 

 theyme last ses-iio w ch they coniunicated unto us. And 

 to know whether they will ioyne w th us in an answer to 

 his ma'J or els to doe it of our selves. 



" Mr. Brook dislikes the motio that the message should 

 be compared w lh the letter, for that might give some dis- 

 content, his opinio was that the matter of supplie is the 

 easiest to be resolved & he wished it may be granted. 

 But if the king will stand to the 3 other p" he thinks the 

 contract cannot goe forward. 



" 1 Impossible f r us to give a 3'early recompence to the 

 officers, for as they fall how shall the land be discharged 



" 2 It is impossible to rayse 200,000 out of the land 

 onely. the rest out of mchandize & a running subsidy 

 fro the nionied men 



" 3 Also it is not safe to bargaine except the imposi- 

 tions be cast into it, and that the king be restrayned fro 

 further imposing 



" S r Tho Beomont. If wee goe forward wee are undone 

 charging the land so deeply as is desyred. And on the 

 other side if we goe not forward it is dangerous. 



" The lib'? of the subiects much impeached, magna 

 charta not now to be spoken of. The statutes of 5 E i & 

 E 3 & the rest restraining the king fro imposing not 

 regarded at all. The 3G statutes against purveyance to 

 no purpose. In matter of government how stands our case. 

 The statute of 1 Eliz. was first intended to bridle the 

 papists and accordingly used in his knowledge. But now 

 it is extended to all offences almost. The walls betwixt 

 the kinge & his sub" are his lawes. Now to what purpose 

 are lawes if his mat ie or his ministers will leape over or 

 breake downe this wall 



" he is charged by his contry to assent & go forward 

 w' h the bargaine & to adde sometbinge f r supply so that 

 the impositions and other our greavances may be cast in. 

 But to yeald to this that is now desyred he cannot. And 

 therefore he wished that wee might desyre his ma' to. 

 give us leave to acquaint hym what wee intend, and are 

 able to doe in the matt r of supplie & support, and howe 

 wee are wills it may be levied. And thereupon to ac- 

 quaint us w th his resolution 



" M r James. He could not assent to the contract unless 

 all the impositions were taken away, & all arbitrary 





