ORAL ARGUMENT OF JAMES C. CARTER, ESQ. 195 



The President. No other person has authority to kill a seal, you 

 just said. There are laws agaiost the killiug; of seals. Then if the 

 only ones who have authority to kill a seal are the company, then the 

 company must be interdicted from killing females"? 



Mr. Carter. It is interdicted by law — tbe law of the United States. 

 A statute of the United States binds ev^en the action of the executive 

 government. The executive government of the United States could 

 not give authority to kill a female seal. It is a crime. 



Mr. Justice Harlan. Mr. Carter, some of the Arbitrators want to 

 know whether the concession granted to this comi)any was granted by 

 the executive department uiuler the authority of an act of Congress"? 



Mr. Carter. It was. There was a special act of Congress providing 

 that the islands might b& leased out and provision made for putting 

 the privilege up at auction and selling it to the highest bidder; and 

 the lease was executed in pursuance of those provisions. The govern- 

 ment was compensated in two forms; first, by a gross sum paid annu- 

 ally, and then by a royalty upon each seal killed. 



Lord Hannen. It was only the source of the lease that we wanted 

 to get at — whether it was under the direct power of an act of parlia- 

 ment, or whether it was done by the executive. 



Mr. Carter. It was done by the executive department of the gov- 

 ernment under the authority and in the discharge of its duties imposed 

 upon it by the act of Congress. 



The President. By a special act of Congress? 



Mr. Carter. By a special act of Congress. 



The President. Not made for this company, but made for the 

 leasing? 



Mr. Carter. Oh no; not made for this company. 



Mr. Justice Harlan. In Section 4 of the Act of Congress of July 

 1st, 1870, it is provided "That the Secretary of the Treasury shall lease 

 for the rental mentioned in section six of this act" the privilege of 

 taking seals on these islands. 



The President. The act of leasing to such company was the mere 

 action of the executive. 



Mr. Justice Harlan. Under the authority of the act of Congress. 

 The Tribunal thereupon took a recess.] 

 The Court resumed at 2.15 p. m.] 



Mr. Carter. Wh«n the Tribunal rose for its recess I was stating 

 that, as a matter of fact, it is possible to take 100,000 young males 

 from the herd without diminishing its normal number. 



Mr. Justice Harlan. Are you speaking of the present time or a 

 previous period? 



Mr. Carter. I was taking the herd at its maximum amount; that 

 is, I assume that if man withholds his hand the herd will reach a 

 certain maximum beyond which it will not go if left to exclusively 

 natural causes. If man interferes and confines his draft to the young 

 males he may take 100,000 annually without diminishing the normal 

 numbers of che herd. The first draft will of course diminish the 

 number by the number taken; but after the first few years the normal 

 number will remain the same. I had stated, as supporting that view, 

 that drafts to the extent of fi-om fifty to seventy-five thousand had 

 been taken under Russian occupation, and the herd had increased 

 from a depressed condition, so that at the time when it passed into the 

 hands of the American Government its numbers were as large as, if 

 not larger than, ever. I had spoken of the irregular and indiscrim- 

 inate drafts of 1868, when 240,000 were taken in one year. When the 



