ORAL ARGUMENT OF FREDERICK R COUDERT, ESQ. 345 



Mr. CouDERT. — And that is what I propose to read to the learned 

 Court. 



As to the question the President put, the Commander Island skins 

 are the same, whetlier killed at sea or on laiid. There is no doubt about 

 that. I understand that those killed at sea on the western side of the 

 Pacific Ocean go to the market as the Japan catch. 



Sir Charles Kussell. — No, that is not so. 



Mr. Phelps. — They go as the Copper or Commander Islands catch. 



Mr. Coudert. — Well, I will read the evidence on that. I am indebted 

 to the President for having relieved the monotony of this Argument by 

 throwing a brand of discord among us. 



The President. — I wish to clear it up. 



Mr. CoiTDERT. — It is extremely refresliing to me. I do not know if 

 it is to the Court, but it cannot be otherwise. I have just read to the 

 High Tribunal the cross examination of Mr. Stamp. I will have in 

 mind the question put, and see what the fact is with regard to that. 



Mr. Justice Harlan. — Have you read all of that Deposition that you 

 want to read? 



Mr. Coudert. — No; I have not. I am thankful to Mr. Justice 

 Harlan for calling my attention to it. This is what this expert says: 



The differences between the Copper and Alaska skins are difficult to describe so 

 thnt they can be understood by any person who has no practical knowledge of furs, 

 but to anyone skilled in the business there are apparent differences in colour between 

 the Copper and Alaska skins, and a difference in the length and qualities of the 

 hairs which compose the fur, and there are also apparent slight differences in the 

 shape of the skins. 



The differeuces between the skins of the three catches are so marked that they 

 have always been expressed in the different prices obtained for the skins. I have 

 attended the sales for many years, and am able to make this statement from my own 

 knowledge. The average prices obtained at the sales of the last year's catch, for 

 instance, were as follows: For the Alaska skins, 125 shillings per skin; for the 

 Copper skins, 68 shillings per skin ; and for the Northwest skins, 53 shillings per skin. 



This corroborates what I have already read, and emphasizes the point 

 I want to make that although the difference in price between a muti- 

 lated skin, the skin of an animal riddled with shot, and that of one 

 killed as we kill it on the islands, is plain and easily accounted for, yet 

 when you find that the same company, using the same methods and 

 dealing with an animal of the same general genus or species, when you 

 find the product of the industry is so difterent that in one case the 

 skin brings 125s, and in the other about one half, then the difference 

 in the thing itself is so manifest and so great that it cannot be whittled 

 away and minimised by any pretence that there is an intermixture. 



Now with regard to the witnesses who have been cross-examined, 

 before I abandon this subject, I desire to read from the Appendix to 

 the British Case volume 2 pp. 230 to 253 — you will find there the testi- 

 mony. I will take the substance of it and state what the result is. 



I take one single declaration which is concurred in by a very large 

 number — 27 I think — of these witnesses. 



We have such witnesses as Mr. Richard Henry Poland, William Henry 

 Smith, Thomas Ince, Sydney Poland,— I think I may say that we have 

 the prominent men in that trade in London and this is a declaration on 

 cross examination which many of them make. This is a condensation, 

 almost the very words, but you have to read from 230 to 253 to verify 

 the accuracy of my summing up. 



That the fur of the Alaskan seal is *)f a better quality and denser than that of the 

 Copper seal, and that the difference makes the latter skins less valuable than the 

 former. 



