27 



Mr. Leonard. That is right. Now, this bill does attempt to deal 

 with that by providing a basis for revenues of the counties for a 

 period of 10 years, based on what the lands would have paid. 



Mr. GOODLATTE. Would the lands be given back after 10 years? 



Mr. Leonard. No. It is intended as a transition period. 



Mr. GooDLATTE. So if they are taken out of the tax base, they 

 are gone forever, regardless of how long they get some kind of eco- 

 nomic benefit; is that correct? 



Mr. Leonard. That is correct. 



Mr. CjOODLATTE. I understand that there is some endangered 

 species to be protected in this area; is that correct? 



Mr. Leonard. That is a significant part of the interest in acquir- 

 ing these lands, yes, sir. 



Mr. GrOODLATTE. And what are those species? 



Mr. Leonard. The primary one of concern is the marbled 

 murrelet. 



Mr. GoODLATTE. And how many of them are there, the tract that 

 we are talking about? 



Mr. Leonard. I will ask Dr. Ralph, who is an expert in that field, 

 to respond. 



Mr. Ralph. My estimate is approximately 1,000 birds are in the 

 area that we are talking about, of the 44,000 acres. 



Mr. GoODLATTE. What about the 4,500-acre Headwaters tract? 



Mr. Ralph. It is a very difficult species to study and to measure 

 its population. It is very secretive. 



My best guess would be something like 60 percent of that figure, 

 but that is very difficult to measure precisely. Mostly our popu- 

 lation estimates are based on the birds at sea. We can count them 

 there. They can't hide behind trees and things like that; so that is 

 the basis for our population estimate. 



Mr. GOODLATTE. At 500 or 600 birds that is about $1 million a 

 bird. Can you give us any guidance as to what kind of resources 

 the Congress — ^I am from Virginia, far away from this area — what 

 kind of resources the Congress should be expending to protect this 

 species, when we are talking about that kind of cost that we are 

 going to expend? 



Mr. Ralph. I am a scientist. Unfortunately, that is a policy issue, 

 and I don't usually deal with that sort of thing. I will leave that 

 to your wisdom. 



Mr. GrOODLATTE. Well, you might have an opinion on it. 



Mr. Ralph. No; I don't. 



Mr. GOODLATTE. The buck stops here. 



Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 



Mr. Bishop. Thank you very much, Mr. Goodlatte. 



Mr. GOODLATTE. Or maybe it starts here, Mr. Chairman, I am 

 not sure. 



Mr. Bishop. Let me ask Mr. Leonard, I was interested in the line 

 of discourse there regarding the loss of tax revenue to the, I as- 

 sume the counties and the State because of the transfer from pri- 

 vate to public ownership. 



Along those lines, are there any provisions of law, policy, already 

 in existence that deal with this revenue loss that will compensate 

 the counties and the State partially for loss of revenue? For exam- 

 ple, county payments based on a percentage of the 5deld when it 



