30 



pretend, well, like we can just do business as usual and let the 

 company continue to cut these last few thousand acres of trees. 



I mean, the FEMAT report itself points out that unless we pro- 

 tect these pristine growths of old growth, we are going to have 

 more species that are listed in the Endangered Species Act. Just 

 look at the coho salmon. As you know, there is a petition for the 

 coho that is going to be filed on October 21 in California. We have 

 lost a $100 million coho recreational and commercial industry in 

 California already because of the fact that that species is being 

 driven into extinction; and testimony that we have entered into the 

 record from Dr. Peter Moyle states that perhaps as much as 10 

 percent of the remaining coho spawning habitat in the State of 

 California is in this Headwaters region. So we need to do some- 

 thing, and I totally agree with you. It can't be done through any 

 sole source. 



In November of 1994, there will be a measure on the California 

 ballot which provides for $214 million for acquisition of ancient for- 

 ests. There are possibilities for land transfer within the State of 

 California or from throughout the Federal system, so we are going 

 to have to be very creative. And Mr. Leonard, I think, has said 

 this, so what the administration wants to do in inviting this bill 

 to go forward is enter into a serious negotiation, using all the tools 

 in our bag, to try to achieve a very import£int public purpose. 



Mr. VOLKMER. Gentlemen, my suggestion would be that we con- 

 tinue to negotiate with the administration over methodology by 

 which to finance the acquisition. And then once that is done, then 

 I think we could move on the bill. 



But I just don't see it at the present time. I don't know; perhaps 

 there can be some transfers worked out, perhaps there can be some 

 methodology whereby the State comes up with part of the money 

 and we use part of the Land and Water Conservation Fund and all 

 those things, and perhaps it can be done over time. 



Of course, that has a lot to do with the present owners, how long 

 they want to wait for their money, also. You understand that. That 

 all has to be done. 



I don't think we can impose an acquisition on someone and then 

 say, well, you wait around, we will figure out how to pay you and 

 take people's land without — we have a Constitution that says you 

 don't take public use without compensation, and I think we need 

 to do that. 



So I am willing to work with the gentleman from California be- 

 cause, like I said, I would love to acquire especisdly the Headwaters 

 Forest area. I think it should be done. I don't disagree on that at 

 all. But just personally I still haven't seen where you are going to 

 get the money to do it. And if you can work it out, fine with me, 

 no problem. 



Mr. Hamburg. If the gentleman would just yield for 1 second, I 

 think that is what this bill really does, Harold, it sets in motion 

 a negotiation between the Agriculture Department on behalf of the 

 Forest Service and the current owners of the property, Maxxam 

 Corporation; and it is a vehicle to move forward on doing exactly 

 what you and I agree needs to be done. 



Mr. Bishop. Thank you. 



