27 



put into effect the fees. And I do not think we are going to accept 

 some of the cuts. 



Now, somehow or another, we have got to figure out a way to 

 cross that bridge. 



Senator Kerry. Senator, I could not agree with you more. You 

 are right on target. I think it is a starting point. The concept is on 

 the table. We know we have to find some money. We are going to 

 have to think this through. And I think, if we can spend some time, 

 as we will, working on it, we will see what we can come up with. 

 But this really underscores the dilemma that I was talking about 

 up front, and I do hot know anybody yet who thinks we are operat- 

 ing with that $82 million in hand. 



Senator Stevens. I have just got three specific issues. Dr. Baker, 

 on the charts. I note that you are predicting an increase in fees — 

 from the charts — I think it is $13 million overall. I think that in- 

 cludes aeronautical as well as nautical charts. But on the nautical 

 charts, vou are canceling 127 charts in areas where there are too 

 few soldf — not closing down the place of sale, but closing down the 

 charts. 



Our examination shows that the area where it is being discon- 

 tinued is the Pacific Northwest and Alaska; 39 in Alaska, 17 in 

 Washington, and 9 in Oregon. The reason that there are so few 

 sold is that there are not that many new boatmen in that area and 

 there is not a high demand. But the new people who come in, they 

 have got to have those charts. 



Now, I just cannot understand — ^how are we going to get charts 

 to replace those 39 maps for Alaska? How will we get them in Alas- 

 ka? 



Dr. Baker. I think you have identified a weak point of our budg- 

 et here in that charting. It is something we are going to have to 

 go back and look at. We need to try to find some money, and I am 

 not convinced that is the best way for us to save money, and I 

 think you made a very good point there. 



Senator Stevens. Thank you. Doctor. And, again, I would like to 

 help you replace that money with something else. I have got some 

 ideas on that, too. 



Second, is the Yukon chum salmon decline. I am going to go up 

 in August again to visit some of those villages that are really suf- 

 fering because of that disaster there. There was a freeze in 1988. 

 It was a Presidentially declared disaster. None of us thought one 

 little bit about what was going to happen to the salmon fry that 

 were in the Yukon. It was one real deep freeze. 



It is obvious that we lost that run. We have made disaster relief 

 available, as the chairman noted, in the overfished areas of the 

 Northeast. But, in the Yukon area where these people have been 

 suffering, and have suffered considerably, because of the total col- 

 lapse of the chum salmon run due to natural causes, I do not think 

 we have done anything to help. 



I tried last year to get a commitment in this bill, and we were 

 unable to get it. Now we have got the chum run coming in again, 

 and the State has announced that chum fishing before the chum 

 enter the Yukon will be cut in half We are trying to preserve that 

 run. But I see nothing in your program which addresses the Yukon 

 chum or Yukon salmon supply. 



