38 



Mr. Stenholm. Thank you very much. All of your statements in 

 their entirety will be made a part of the record. 



Any questions? 



Mr. Dooley. 



Mr. Dooley. Mr. Keeling, on your statement to continue to allow 

 for the incidental sale of seeds. My concern on that account is do 

 we basically give tacit approval to continued sales of a product that 

 should have some level of protection under the property rights? I 

 don't have a problem if we could tighten down the restriction with 

 incidental, but I do have a problem if we are going to basically 

 allow for the incidental sale of seeds when that was the intent of 

 that person who was saving that seed. 



Mr. Keeling. Well, our intention is that the amount of incidental 

 sales are going to be so insignificant and, as was alluded to here, 

 the profits from that are going to be so marginal that it is just not 

 going to be worth it. We are not wanting to continue the situations 

 that exist today where the line is drawn so ambiguously that no- 

 body knows where they are. We want it drawn in a hard way at 

 a very low level, but not to put that person who ends up with some 

 extra seed in a position where they are forced to violate the law 

 because those sales are going to take place, and it is not, in our 

 opinion, the person that the seed company wants to get after any- 

 way. 



Mr. Dooley. It is not of a magnitude that is going to have 

 that 



Mr. Keeling. No, and we would be glad to sit down with every- 

 body and work out what it is. It is very difficult to define how to 

 do it. I mean, a number is a very rough way to do it because celery 

 seed is very different from wheat or cotton seed, but we feel like 

 that the expertise exists within the seed industry to help us define 

 that point that is of no harm to them. 



Mr. Dooley. Mr. Strouts, would you concur with that? 



Mr. STROUTS. Yes, I think the problem is where to draw the line, 

 so to speak, and I would certainly agree that the great amount of 

 the damage is done by those who intend to skirt the provisions of 

 PVPA, yes. 



I have neighbors who purposely grow thousands of bushels in- 

 tending to set themselves up as seedsmen, and they pay little or 

 no attention to the rules. In fact, they ignore the rules. They just 

 do it. 



Mr. Dooley. Mr. Schmidt, I am sorry I wasn't here for your tes- 

 timony. I had a chance to read it. But just on this specific topic and 

 issue, then, you believe the legislation, as presently drafted, pro- 

 vides for the level of protection for seed developers? 



Mr. Schmidt. The way it is drafted right now, it will protect the 

 farmer for the right to save his own seed for use on his own hold- 

 ings. There is report language right now that was drafted by the 

 Senate which I think takes care of that issue regarding the inciden- 

 tal sales. Because if you allow incidental sales without describing 

 what it means, that can mean a lot for somebody and very little 

 for somebody else. So I think it has to be laid out in some report 

 language, which has been done, and I believe satisfactorily for the 

 ASTA. 



Mr. Dooley. Thank you. 



