32 



Mr. Rose. And I just want — you talk about the spraying hurting 

 our timber. I think in Dr. Cobb's testimony, he talks about methyl 

 bromide being under consideration for complete banning in four to 

 six years. And the department is talking about using methyl bro- 

 mide as a method for spraying. 



I think you are going to be — ^you could be in a real box. You are 

 going to be having — we are going to be introducing through not 

 only timber but all these other things, all these other vegetables 

 and plants and so forth that we are importing into this country, all 

 kinds of pests and pathogens and then have no tools to fight them. 

 You are not going to be allowed to use anything to spray with. 



It is politically incorrect to spray in California now for anything. 

 Underarm deodorant people are in trouble in Southern California. 



We are going to go vote and we will be right back. 



[Brief recess.] 



Mr. Rose. The committee will please come to order. 



I apologize that we had so many votes when we adjourned. Dr. 

 Joy Belsky was testifying and she may proceed At this time. 



Ms. Belsky. Mr. Chairman, first I would like to answer your 

 question about whether we will have to discontinue the use of pes- 

 ticides. As you mentioned earlier, pesticides are not the answer. 

 Most insects and other pests evolve resistance to pesticides in time 

 and we have to keep putting more pesticides into the environment. 

 Daily we learn of the new risks of pesticides to human health. The 

 best answer is to prevent the entrance of these pests into the Unit- 

 ed States. That is the best we can do and that should be the first 

 line of defense. 



The gypsy moth, for example, was first brought into the United 

 States by a scientist who wanted to study the possibility of using 

 gypsy moth for silk production. When a few of the gypsy moths 

 flew out of his window, we started an epidemic that has continued 

 for over 100 years. We have not been able to stop the spread of 

 gypsy moths, no matter how much insecticide we have applied. 



I am sure if that scientist had realized the consequences of his 

 bringing gypsy moths into the United States he would not have 

 done it. We know the consequences of bringing pests from other 

 parts of the world into our forested regions and we should not do 

 it also. 



Also, fungicides do not work in our forests. They work in simple 

 ecosystems such as in cultivated fields, but they do not work in 

 complex ecosystems such as forests. Fungicides will kill fungi such 

 as mycorrhizae and decomposers that are critical for the function 

 of our ecosystems. So we cannot just wait and depend on pesticides 

 to solve the problems we create by allowing inadequately treated 

 wood articles into the U.S. 



Just to finish up with a few things that have not been mentioned 

 earlier. One of the absurdities I mentioned in my testimony was 

 leaving certification up to the importers and to the exporters. Cer- 

 tification that the rules have been complied with will not be up to 

 APHIS officials or even to government officials in other countries, 

 it is left up to the exporters of the wood articles. 



In Siberia, we know that the timber industry is run by a "mafia" 

 and is very corrupt. Mr. David Gordon, Director of the Siberian 

 Forest Project, asked me to inform you that his experience of work- 



