to several other places and already milled them. The sawdust has 

 to be segregated. Do you think the mills are really going to seg- 

 regate the sawdust and burn it from these logs? 



They are admitting there is a continuing problem. It could be 

 simply solved at very little expense. Heat treat the logs thoroughly 

 in New Zealand and Chile. It would not be that expensive and it 

 would avoid the risk. 



Why take the risk? Why give someone a buck a thousand or two 

 bucks a thousand additional profit to risk the entire ecosystem of 

 the West? Does not make sense to me. 



Mr. Smith of Oregon. So you are not advocating the elimination 

 of imports of logs or wood products; you are more concerned about 

 the scientific mitigation possibility of insect introduction? 



Mr. DeFazio. That is correct. And from the beginning I have said 

 what I want to see is these logs treated in such a way, starting 

 with the Siberian logs to absolutely minimize risk. And the Sibe- 

 rian recommendations, I think, were pretty thorough. 



Mr. Smith of Oregon. So we will listen to the scientists also to 

 determine whether you are right or wrong. 



Mr. DeFazio. Sure, but, again, obviously, treat everybody with 

 the same degree of useful skepticism you usually treat experts. 



Mr. Smith of Oregon. Your experts or mine? Thank you, Mr. 

 Chairman. 



Mr. Rose. Any other questions? I think you should just come on 

 up here and sit with us. 



Mr. DeFazio. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 



Mr. Rose. And let's move on to Mr. B. Glen Lee, the Deputy Ad- 

 ministrator, Plant Protection and Quarantine, APHIS; accompanied 

 by Michael Rains, the Deputy Chief of the Forest Service, accom- 

 panied by Dr. Nancy Lorimer. 



All the witnesses' testimony will be totally included in the record. 

 You can use your own judgment. It will be up to you as to how 

 much you use or whether you summarize or not. 



Mr. Lee, you proceed, sir. 



STATEMENTS OF B. GLEN LEE, DEPUTY ADMINISTRATOR, 

 PLANT PROTECTION AND QUARANTINE, ANIMAL AND PLANT 

 HEALTH INSPECTION SERVICE, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF AGRI- 

 CULTURE AND MICHAEL RAINS, ASSOCIATE DEPUTY CHIEF, 

 FOREST SERVICE, ACCOMPANIED BY NANCY LORIMER, FOR- 

 EST PEST MANAGEMENT DIVISION, FOREST SERVICE 



Mr. Lee. Thank you, Chairman Rose and Members of the sub- 

 committee. 



Mr. Rose. You are the Deputy Administrator for all of APHIS. 



Mr. Lee. For the plant protection and quarantine section of 

 APHIS. Within APHIS, we have the four major components. There 

 is veterinary service, international services, the biologies, bio- 

 technology, and environmental protection and plant protection. 



Mr. Rose. What is biologies and biotechnology? 



Mr. Lee. That is the unit that does most of the evaluations on 

 environmental science and technology; evaluating the risks associ- 

 ated with a product that goes through the process of genetic manip- 

 ulation. 



Mr. Rose. Thank you. Go ahead. Doctor Lee. 



