692 



Mr. Bryant. Fine. All I am saying — I think it is clear what I am 

 saying. You cannot claim somebody smoked as a matter of free 

 choice and, at the same time, admit that they are addicted to your 

 product, now can you? 



Mr. James Johnston. Mr. Congressman, I'm not a litigation law- 

 yer or expert. 



Mr. Bryant. But I would hope you are a logical thinker. 



Mr. James Johnston. I am, I hope. 



Mr. Bryant. I think the logic leads us to that conclusion. When 

 everybody on the panel says the same thing and, Mr. Horrigan, you 

 took offense at our questioning a moment ago, but when everybody 

 on the panel says the same thing and, astonishingly, says it in the 

 same way, as you did a moment ago when you affirmed that you 

 did not believe nicotine is addictive, it raises the question about 

 whether or not the response was rehearsed. 



Mr. Horrigan, did your lawyer tell you that you needed to affirm 

 today without equivocation that nicotine is not addictive? 



Mr. Horrigan. No one had to tell me anything about my opin- 

 ions about addiction, sir. 



Mr. Bryant. Did this group discuss the need to state clearly in 

 the same words as you all did, in the same words that nicotine is 

 not addictive? 



Mr. Campbell. Absolutely not. 



Mr. Horrigan. You may think that we get together and meet. 

 That's absolutely outrageous. 



Mr. Bryant. What is outrageous? 



Mr. Horrigan. That is outrageous for you to assume that we 

 meet and talk about these issues. We are competitors. We're inde- 

 pendent. We're fighting for survival in a legitimate marketplace. 



Mr. Bryant. You mean you have never collaborated 



Mr. Horrigan. And we all have our own opinions. 



Mr. Bryant. You have never collaborated in defending against a 

 product liability case brought against you for making people dead 

 and sick? 



Mr. Horrigan. If lawsuits are brought against companies to- 

 gether, then the companies obviously, as a group, would protect 

 themselves if they are brought together. 



Mr. Bryant. That is all I'm talking about, Mr. Horrigan, I would 

 also observe, Mr. Horrigan, it is very difficult for me to find you 

 at this table characterizing anything as outrageous after 7 appar- 

 ently intelligent people have stood here and told the American peo- 

 ple, 250 million of whom know better, that cigarettes are not ad- 

 dictive. What could be more ridiculous? 



So if we sit up here a little skeptical of your answers in other 

 areas, you will understand why. 



Now, Mr, Johnston, the Mr, Johnston who is with R,J. Reynolds, 

 we have spent a long time on the medical and scientific aspects of 

 nicotine addiction today. Behind the medical and scientific jargon 

 about self-administration and reenforcing effects are, of course, real 

 people who are suffering real pain and serious diseases and ulti- 

 mately loss of life because of their addiction to cigarettes. 



I have a letter from one of these people, Mr. Pat McLaughlin 

 from Florida. It is marked as Exhibit No. 11. I think Ms. 

 McLaughlin's letter should be read. She writes, "I must comment 



