55 



the lot, because people were not able to make estimates or they 

 don't, anyway. 



Mr. CosTLE. The first thing they have to do is acknowledge limits 

 of current technology to clean up these sites. I mean I think you 

 put your finger on it. There are some sites we are just going to 

 have to quarantine, take reasonable remediation steps, come back 

 to when we have new technologies, monitor adequately in the 

 meantime. We cannot afford to go do everything at every site. I 

 think that is part of the key. I think we need a more concerted 

 effort to encourage and develop innovative clean-up technologies. 

 There is a lot we can do to improve the efficiency of the settlement 

 process. 



I think it is not that everybody wants to simply be able to make 

 a contribution and walk away from these sites, because I don't 

 think that is realistic. But I think that you can cap responsibility 

 in the near term, set up an adequate financial mechanism to guar- 

 antee monitoring, create in the meantime the kind of programs 

 that encourage technology innovation and come back in a reasona- 

 ble time later when additional clean-up technologies will in fact be 

 feasible. 



But at some point the government has got to bite the bullet on 

 the issue of how clean is clean enough for now, and that I think 

 takes away much of the sting that lies behind this fear of the joint 

 and several liability, that it may be unlimited. 



Dr. Hair. A small point, Mr. Chairman, is that, despite I think 

 some significant progress made under Administrator Reilly, there 

 still is a very significant lack of public confidence in the whole 

 process of what defines clean-up standards. I think a real strong 

 case can be made and ought to be looked at by a committee like 

 this is turning this into a public works project, where in fact the 

 U.S. Army Corps of Engineers becomes the contracting manage- 

 ment agency for the public. They are basically looking for a new 

 mission. They have dammed up all the rivers in America and now 

 they want something new to do, and this would be a wonderful way 

 to take that massive engineering capacity and turn it into a public 

 works project that serves the American people better. 



Chairman Glenn. I am not sure they agree with your character- 

 ization of their duties. 



Dr. Hair. They have also drained a few swamps, too. [Laughter.] 



Chairman Glenn. We are into about the 13th year now, I guess 

 we are into the 13th year of Superfund, right? 



Mr. CosTLE. Yes, I think so. 



Chairman Glenn. And as GAO said — and you were here when I 

 read this earlier today out of the high-risk series that we have 

 sponsored with GAO— at the end of 1992, EPA obligated $11.4 bil- 

 lion, and after 13 years we only cleaned up 12 percent, clean-ups 

 completed at fewer than 12 percent of the Superfund sites, and 

 they are talking $40 billion and maybe going out with the addition- 

 al sites they see now, maybe $300 billion over the next 30 years. I 

 think the response to the President's remark last night that I 

 brought up earlier to Administrator Browner indicated what 

 people think about this. He said we are going to take that money 

 away from lawyers and put it into cleaning things up. Hooray, a 



