26 



Mr. Studds. Yes. 



Mr. BiGFORD. — not just to the fisherman. 



Mr. Studds. All right. 



Mr. Kraus. If I might comment? The problem with that is that 

 we do not know, because there is no monitoring, when the whales 

 are there. 



Mr. Studds. It is a little hard to warn ships away then. 



Mr. BiGFORD. That is why we started the program 



Mr. Studds. Right. 



Mr. BiGFORD. — without an end period. 



Mr. Studds. Right. 



Mr. BiGFORD. It is ongoing. 



Mr. Studds. Dr. Mayo, I think you answered the question I was 

 going to ask you at the very end of your statement. I was going to 

 ask you specifically what we could do to ensure that the effects on 

 the whales are detected and mitigated in time. You listed a series 

 of things at the very end of your statement. Do you want — would 

 you like any additional time to elaborate on that? I think what you 

 enumerated at the end was fairly consistent with what NMFS had 

 recommended in terms of their conservation recommendations; am 

 I correct? 



Dr. Mayo. Well, I think there needs to be a lot more flesh on it. 

 The point we need to remember about these habitats is that, al- 

 though we, as one group, have been studying the environment for 

 some time — I think I can safely say that none of us who are work- 

 ing in our project have a passing understanding yet of exactly what 

 it is that right whales need. We are getting there, but we have not 

 arrived. I think we need to get a little bit closer to begin to make 

 those judgments. 



Mr. Studds. Right. Let me put it this way. When Mr. Kotelly in 

 just a moment is prepared to commit the EPA to treat as binding 

 the recommendations of the National Marine Fisheries Service and 

 to state to us that he is going to make it a condition of the permit, 

 is there anything we should add before we get that commitment 

 from him? Do they still need fleshing? 



Dr. Mayo. Yes. I think there are lots of ways of looking at it. I 

 believe there needs to be considerable detail. I do not think it was 

 in the scope of Fisheries probably to put that detail down. There is 

 monitoring and there is monitoring. We have some excellent moni- 

 toring going on within the Bay system, but it is certainly in no way 

 reflective of what we need to know of right whales and their habi- 

 tat. 



Mr. Studds. I think I get that message. 



Now, Mr. Kotelly, I was struck by the fact that your testimony 

 does not seem to me yet to be an unequivocal commitment to re- 

 specting the recommendations of NMFS. As I understand it, you 

 said you are going to take their recommendations on additional 

 monitoring back to the Monitoring Task Force. What is the Moni- 

 toring Task Force and who is on it? 



Mr. Kotelly. The Monitoring Task Force consists of representa- 

 tives actually from many of the people at this table. NMFS is on it; 

 people from the University of Massachusetts, Massachusetts DEP 

 are on it; there are three organizations from the Cape, including 

 Mr. Mayo's organization; NOAA is on it; people from Harvard. So, 



