27 



The Science Advisory Board at EPA reviewed the President's 

 budget request for fiscal year 1995 just months ago and expressed 

 concern about the long-term erosion that has occurred in the level 

 of the agency's R&D activities. According to SAB "EPA's R&D 

 budget has declined, measured in real dollars, from $460 million in 

 fiscal year 1980 to $440 million in fiscal year 1995. That is a real 

 decline of 4 percent since fiscal year 1980." 



I would like to turn to the very back page of my testimony. I am 

 used to seeing these numbers and these surprise even me. 



In the same 1980-95 period, according to the American Associa- 

 tion for the Advancement of Science, using the same constant dol- 

 lars, defense R&D increased from $21.8 billion to $30.4 billion, a 

 real increase of 39 percent. So defense R&D went up by 39 percent 

 during the same period when EPA R&D went down by 4 percent. 

 Surely our Nation can afford a little more money for important en- 

 vironmental research. 



I will just hit a couple of quick highlights here. 



To the extent that the Committee on Environment and Public 

 Works can become involved in the appropriations process being an 

 advocate for the program and research operations account in the 

 EPA budget, the salaries and expenses account — we believe that 

 this would have an enormous benefit in terms of improving man- 

 agement at EPA. The EPA deserves a lot of credit this year for pro- 

 posing Administrator Browner's contractor conversion initiative. 

 The reality, though, is that the Appropriations Committee has re- 

 duced the account in the bill approved last week and it remains to 

 be seen what is going to come out of conference. 



Something like salaries and expenses at EPA is one of these bor- 

 ing issues that no single Member of Congress is going to champion. 

 It would be extremely helpful if the Committee on Environment 

 and Public Works could perhaps adopt this as a pet cause. I think 

 that would do an enormous amount for EPA's R&D management. 



Finally, I would just like to call to your attention the macro 

 budget issues. We are having a fundamental debate about the role 

 of Government in this country. This year, we saw cuts in discre- 

 tionary spending. We need to understand that no matter what this 

 committee does with authorization levels on EPA R&D, that could 

 be a lot less important than congressional actions on things like 

 overall levels of discretionary spending, entitlement reform, deficit 

 reduction, and health care cost containment. Unless we can get our 

 fiscal house in order here, we are not going to have the money to 

 invest in anything, be it defense R&D or EPA R&D. 



I think everyone who receives money from the EPA for research, 

 everyone who supports EPA research, needs to begin to admit that 

 they like Government, that they believe in discretionary spending, 

 that they want our Nation to invest in the future. We need to start 

 fighting for that or this will all be gone in 10 or 15 years. 



Senator Reid. Let me just interrupt and say that you have given 

 the same speech I give at town hall meetings, to high school stu- 

 dents, college students — whoever will listen. I think you have said 

 a lot. 



I believe that what has happened in this country, in the last 15 

 years, to cause people to dislike their Government has come from 

 a number of different sources and has been caused by us with all 



