191 



Mr. Gavin. Well, I believe that you should get a report as to the 

 most recent progress at Princeton. I think progress has been made. 

 I think there is a better understanding of what is going on in that 

 machine, and I think that compared to, say, 3 years ago, between 

 the Joint European Torus and the Princeton machine, a great deal 

 is understood which wasn't previously understood. 



Now, I believe that— well, first of all, I am not going to make a 

 statement as to whether we are ready to do something or not, be- 

 cause I am an engineer, not a scientist, and we are still in the sci- 

 ence part of this program. 



I think it perhaps becomes very complex as to how science and 

 engineering do become related because I think in this particular 

 endeavor the two are very tightly related because some of the 

 things that are postulated by the scientists just aren't going to 

 happen unless some awfully good engineering is accomplished. 



The real question then is how big a step to take beyond what we 

 have currently in hand. This is something I think should be debat- 

 ed by people that are better qualified than I am in considerable 

 depth. One of the reasons why we have to have a better understood 

 and approved program is so that we can enter those discussions on 

 an equal basis, and I think that if we can do that, there is some 

 chance that an international collaboration will be of advantage to 

 all of us. 



Mr. LujAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 



Mr. FuQUA. Joe, thank you very much. 



Mr. Gavin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 



Mr. FuQUA. We hope we didn't keep you over your time. 



[Answers to questions asked of Mr. Gavin follow:] 



