24 



person who will be responsible in the kind of broadest sense that 

 we have to act or will we be self defeating no matter what we do? 



Mr. Hallock. Mr. Chairman, the Power Council could fill that 

 void totally but for one small drawback, constitutionality. In creat- 

 ing us, you have created a unique, near-regional government. How- 

 ever, we pride ourselves on, as I said, being comprised of guberna- 

 torial appointees, and to give gubernatorial appointees from four 

 States direct line authority over Federal agencies, I understand 

 would transcend certain provisions of the Constitution. 



We still can serve an important role, but in direct response to 

 the Chair's question, I guess within the Federal bureaucracy you 

 will probably, to meet the constitutional flats, have to have that 

 czar of congressional making within the Government. 



As far as the warring between the agencies, to me it is totally 

 indefensible and Congress shouldn't tolerate it. 



Chairman Studds. I appreciate that. This is not a request for vol- 

 unteers agency by agency. I think if no one is leaping to answer 

 the question, it speaks volumes about where we have gone in un- 

 derstanding and sort of stopped. 



Mr. Turner. I wouldn't call this a leap, but maybe a hop. 



I do think there is recognition that coordination of all of the enti- 

 ties that are involved in salmon management is an important 

 thing, and our recognition now of habitat issues being key to suc- 

 cess has broadened that range of governmental agencies far wider 

 than it might have been suggested five, eight, ten years ago, par- 

 ticularly I think on the Federal side where you now have Federal 

 land managers and regulators all dispersed among a variety of 

 agencies, including some that don't immediately come to mind like 

 the State Department that are major players in the arena; and I 

 think that as a practical matter trying to change jurisdictions and 

 authorities of a bunch of different agencies is a difficult task. 



You have the authority to do that at the Federal level. If we 

 start to enter into doing that at the State and tribal level, I think 

 it would become very cumbersome. However, this multitude of ju- 

 risdictions is only a problem because it doesn't reach a decision, 

 and if we can coordinate those actions so that a decision can be 

 made and progress moves forward, I think that that is success, and 

 frankly, I think that we at the State level have, since the Salmon 

 Summit, pointed out our own deficiencies, have worked our tails off 

 to coordinate among State agencies to deliver a clear message 

 about where the States lie on particular issues, and I credit the 

 tribes with the same thing. 



And I think that the President's approach to the Forest Confer- 

 ence has shown how leadership in bringing together the Federal 

 agencies on a particular issue also can lead to success. I don't think 

 that same kind of focus toward policies has occurred at the Federal 

 level with the salmon. 



Chairman Studds. Let me just observe, I will let you answer that 

 the lights apply to us as well. 



Mr. Schmitten. 



Mr. Schmitten. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I think 

 the significance of the salmon recovery issue far out-shadows that 

 of the spotted owl, and I think because of the significance that we 

 should welcome the administration's focus on this issue. I appreci- 



