OCEANOGRAPHY 17 



the results that are desired would be by allowing the Department of 

 Defense to exercise its present authority to request and coordinate any 

 surveys that might be made. 



Dr. Revelle. But you see, Mr. Pelly, this rests on what seems to me 

 to be an inadequate premise and that is that the only reason for making 

 surveys is a military reason outside the continental limits of the 

 United States, and this I do not think is the case. There are also 

 scientific and commercial reasons for making such surveys. 



Mr. Pelly. I think that is an extremely important point, and one 

 that I wanted to see written into the record because I think that when 

 the Department of Defense is pointed up, as it is in this report, as 

 providing "more efficient logistic support and facilities," they are 

 thinking in terms of military values and not of other scientific values 

 that are very desirable. 



Dr. Revelle. I do not mean to imply by this that the Navy has not 

 supported and will not continue to support scientific research on a very 

 liberal and generous scale, but the Department of Defense, in its sur- 

 vey functions as opposed to its support of science, inevitably has to put 

 first things first in accordance with their mission and their mission is 

 obviously the security of the United States ; so that, the survey opera- 

 tions planned and directed by the Department of Defense, regardless 

 of whether they are carried out by Defense Department vessels or by 

 the Coast Survey vessels, have in general quite a narrow objective 

 related to the security of the United States. 



Mr. Pelly. Has it not been our experience in the last few years that 

 the various agencies and services of Government are coordinating their 

 efforts and avoiding the duplication and waste ? Was that your ob- 

 servation ? 



Dr. Revelle. There is no question about tliat, Mr. Pelly, and, in 

 fact, the New Federal Council of Science and Technology has made 

 an experiment in trying to go a good deal further in tliis than has 

 ever been done before, and they have made the experiment in the 

 field of oceanography simply because there was a ready-made case 

 here where several departments of the Government had different in- 

 terests and different activities and the problem was to fit these into 

 one miified, coordinated, nonduplicating, and effective package. 



I was talking to Mr. Kistiakowsky on Saturday, the President's 

 scientific adviser, and his comment was that in the oceanography 

 effort this was what they have been able to do. It is an achievement 

 by them. It is a small field compared with the development of atomic 

 energy or space research, but it is an important field and one in which 

 there have been vested interests of different Government agencies for 

 a long time. They think they have effected, and I am sure they are 

 right, a very satisfactory degree of coordination. I myself am not 

 worried at all about the problem of duplication, both because of this 

 deliberate attempt at coordination within the Federal Council on 

 Science and Technology and more particularly, however, because of 

 the fact that if every surveying ship available to the United States 

 were multiplied by three or four they could all be profitably occu- 

 pied for many years to come in surveying the oceans. 



Mr. Pelly. And the Navy will have a very large voice in the selec- 

 tion of any area outside present limitations because their priority 



