28 OCEANOGRAPHY 



for an oceanogi-aphic progi-am except that it is too definite witli 

 respect to agencies' responsibilities in the future. 



I would prefer to suggest, if you want to set up an oceanographic 

 committee responsible to the Congress, that you give it more general 

 responsibilities and a general level of support that you would expect 

 over the next 10 years than to recommend to you how they would 

 apportion that and distribute that as the years go along. 



The reason that I bring up this point is the following : that in our 

 deliberations about the shipbuilding program which has vexed us 

 greatly, the Department of Commerce and we in the Navy have very 

 urgent need for research and survey ships. In order to fulfill the 

 requirements of the National Academy's report, we have to spend 

 what we consider a very large amount of money, about $400 million 

 over the next 10 years, not only to replace some of the 52 ships that 

 we have now but to augment that number to about 78. This will make 

 great inroads as a program in our normal budgeting for ships within 

 the Navy itself. These ships, then, of the siuwey and research type, 

 are in competition with DE'e, DD"s, with carriers. These are unme- 

 diate military requirements to fulfill the national and international 

 coinmitments that the Navy has right now. 



I think the interagency committee, except for the problem of ap- 

 propriating for ships, can do the kind of a job that you would like to 

 see done. 



We intend to review the 1962 budget before it comes up to Congi'ess, 

 each of us, so that instead of having one congressional committee 

 review the Navy's work and another the Department of Commerce, 

 and another the National Science, and another the Department of 

 Interior, each committee will have the whole national program in 

 oceanography to look at. This interagency committee fulfills a great 

 many of the requirements now. It does not constitute permanency in 

 your context, I believe, sir. 



Mr. Miller. I may say that the bills I am interested in neverthe- 

 less were introduced a good deal with the idea of being retroactive, 

 getting people to think on this subject. I do not think we are going 

 to answer it now, but there are still wide areas that we can investi- 

 gate and talk about. 



Personally, I appreciate your being here and the only thing that 

 worries me is that, in another committee in which I serve, we talk 

 about $55 million as chicken feed. We do not even consider it. We 

 talk of certain things that are going to cost $25 million a bang. We 

 need them. We are going to get them. 



If we could only get some of tliis thinking into this consideration, 

 I am certain that we could make a little more progress. 



I do thank you, sir. 



Mr. Dom? 



Mr. DoRN. I have no questions. 



Mr. Miller. Mr. Lennon? 



Mr. Lenxox. I have no questions. 



Mr. Miller. Mr. Pelly ? 



Mr. Felly. Mr. Chairman, I would certainly want to join you in 

 expressing the feeling that the Secretary has made a good contribu- 

 tion toward a subject wliich is going to require the opinions from all 

 angles to help guide us in coming up with a policy which will be help- 

 ful in expanding the development and research work of oceanography. 



