34 OCEANOGRAPHl' 



tive standpoint? "Wliy should it not receive as much attention and 

 have as much stress placed upon it perhaps as space exploration or 

 similar programs that we have undertaken ? 



Why do we downgrade it in a sense by being satisfied with an inter- 

 agency committee ? How are we going to get to the Appropriations 

 Committees ? How are we going to get to the various departments of 

 Government and have the heads of those departments feel that this 

 is an essential and vital program unless somebody is there pounding 

 away all the time asking and requiring more attention so far as appro- 

 priations are concerned and budgetary requests are concerned? 



Is it not true that if we had a mechanism placing stress on this and 

 this alone that it would be in a far better position to do the selling 

 job tliat is necessary in order to get tlie results that I tliink most of 

 us feel should be gotten and not wait and not be satisfied with just 

 a moderate approach ? 



I do not know whether you want to coimnent on it, but this is my 

 feeling on it from what exposure I have had in the last several 

 months. 



Mr. Wakelin". I would like to comment on it, Mr. Oliver, to this 

 degree. 



Mr. Oli\tee. I wish you would. 



Mr. Wakelix. I used to be a physicist wlien I was younger and, 

 in looking at the support of science not only by the Government but 

 by industry and academic institutions, I fear that you may be sin- 

 gling out oceanography as a special category for special attention when 

 other fields of science and technology may deserve the same support 

 and may not be as glamorous. 



I know that oceanography has a military connotation. I know also 

 that there are many fields of science that are just as important to this 

 country's long-term survival as oceanography. I feel that you 

 must decide how you want to treat the oceanography program in terms 

 of all the other fields of science that come before you before you es- 

 tablish a mechanism for oceanography reporting directly to the 

 Congress itself and a special vehicle b}' which additional funds are 

 created for the program. 



Mr. OiJVER. Thank you very much. 



Mr. Wakelin. 1 am not downgrading oceanography at all but I 

 have these fears as a person. 



Mr. Oliver. I i-ealize that, sir, and I want to express my apprecia- 

 tion to you for that statement. 



I feel that that sums it up certainly far better than anytliing that 

 I can say. 



I feel that that is exactly the issue that confronts tliis committee 

 and the Congress. 



Mr. Wakelix. Might I add one point which is germane to the whole 

 program and is not a personal point. 



In the 1962 budget coming up we have five ships in the program 

 now. Two 1,300 oceanographic auxiliary research ships, 1,300 tons; 

 two 500-ton AGOR's, and a survey ship of 1,300 tons. To put this 

 in tlie proper context, we have one AGOR now in 1960 and one in 

 1961 which have survived. 



There are five now going into the Navy fiscal year 1962 program 

 and if other agencies contribute two or three more, we will be up to 

 the eight. 



