130 EFFECTIVENESS OF THE COMMITTEE ON OCEANOGRAPHY 



Mr. Dingell. That is what we are trying to find out, particularly 

 with regard to the field of oceanography. What we are trying to 

 find out : Is there anything in the structure of ICO, or the Coordinating 

 Committee, which would tend toward, or work toward, a solution of 

 differences of this sort? I am not asking you to say that this is what 

 should be done; I am asking you, is there anything there that you 

 know of? You are the secretary, and this is the reason we are di- 

 recting these questions to you. 



Mr. Abel. No, sir; I do not know of any single jurisdiction which 

 can look down from above and say it must be done this way. The 

 ICO, you understand, does report to the Federal Council for Science 

 and Technology, and ultimately to the President. 



Mr. Dingell. Yes, but within the ICO itself, there is no actual 

 instrumentation for other than dissemination of information. Am I 

 correct? 



Mr. Abel. No, sir; I do not think so. It seems to me that the — 



Mr. Dingell. It is really just a clearinghouse now, because it 

 cannot at this moment effectuate policy determinations and resolu- 

 tion of policy differences within the agencies involved. Am I correct? 



Mr. Abel. That is correct. The ICO cannot determine a policy. 



Mr. Dingell. I am not trying to lay snares for you. I just want 

 you to give us truthful answers, and this committee is not interested 

 in causing you any personal inconvenience or hurt; I assure you of 

 that. We are trying to explore this thing carefully to try to determine 

 how it is working, and whether or not it is subject to change. 



Now let me go further. Assuming that there were mechanisms 

 vested in ICO to resolve these things, how would an individual 

 member who is of middle-management, as you have indicated, go 

 back to the agency and enforce a policy change within the agency? 



Mr. Abel. You say if a jurisdictional authority were assigned to 

 the ICO? In the matter of oceanography or in any agency? 



Mr. Dingell. Yes, how would any representative who represents 

 middle-echelon management go back and enforce the policy change 

 within his Department? 



Mr. Abel. There again, I believe it is somewhat over my head 

 administratively; but it seems to me, personally, he has to reckon 

 with the basic missions of each of the agencies and departments he 

 represents; and these go, of course, far beyond oceanography. 



Mr. Pelly. Will the Chairman yield? 



Mr. Dingell. I will be happy to. 



Mr. Pelly. Would it be a normal procedure for the Bureau of the 

 Budget to settle many of these differences that might arise, as between 

 agencies, and is there some place or procedure by which such decisions 

 could be resolved by the Bureau of the Budget? 



Mr. Abel. Personally, I rather doubt it; but then again, I cannot 

 remember the situation's ever having arisen. 



Mr. Pelly. I think maybe it has not arisen, because everybody 

 has backed away from every problem that came up. But I am just 

 trying to explore in my mind, is there some way to formalize a situation 

 such as we have, so that there can be a resolution of differences of 

 opinion, and some authoritative basis for making a policy decision 

 and enforcing it? 



Mr. Abel. Well, again, as a personal opinion, I do think that each 

 of the members must, and certainly does, recognize that each of the 



