21 



shipment of this oil through another country, and it would hurt us 

 more than it would help us. 



Is Sierra involved in any other country in Africa? 



Mr. Mills. I have worked, over a number of years, with different 

 African countries, primarily in Kenya, with Kenya's Green Belt 

 Movement. 



Mr. Johnston. And what were your results there? 



Mr. Mills. Well, we were able to secure the release of Dr. 

 Maathai when she was being harassed and beaten by the Kenyan 

 Government. 



I think the best thing that ever happened to President Moi was 

 General Sani Abacha. It has taken a lot of the spotlight off him. 



But I think that her offices have just moved out of her home, 

 where they were forced to operate for a long time. So we have had 

 some successes. 



Mr. Johnston. Mr. Wright, have you been to Tanzania? 



Mr. Wright. Yes, I have. Not extensively, though. 



Mr. Johnston. When was your last trip there? 



Mr. Wright. About a year and a half ago. 



Mr. Johnston. Well, you were there with the refugees in the 

 western 



Mr. Wright. I did not get up to that area. 



Mr. Johnston. You did not? 



Mr. Wright. No. 



Mr. Johnston. OK. 



Yes, that is all I have, Madam Chair. Thank you. 



Ms. Ros-Lehtinen. Thank you, Mr. Johnston. 



Don? 



Mr. Payne, Yes. I have a question, Mr. Wright. In regard to wild- 

 life, the question of elephants, for example, and every year a group 

 of Zimbabweans come to meet with me about their problem with 

 elephants. They say they have more elephants than people and 

 they claim they are being overrun and want to sort of have a dis- 

 pensation as relates to cropping the herds and selling the tusk. I 

 certainly have listened, but not been supportive of their request. 



What is your opinion on that situation? 



Mr. Johnston. Excuse me. Could you yield just a second? 



Mr. Payne. Yes. 



Mr. Johnston. As I recall, isn't that the country that has a huge 

 inventory of ivory that is sitting there and all they want to do is 

 put it on the world market and just sell it because it is just sitting 

 in warehouses? 



Mr. Payne. Yes, right. That is true. They do. And that is their 

 main object right now. They do have a lot of them running around, 

 they claim. And, of course, they move it out, then there may be less 

 of them running around. 



But what would your assessment of the situation be? 



Mr. Wright. Well, it is an issue that comes up and it is a very 

 tough issue because it divides different parts of Africa. In a sense, 

 Zimbabwe is being punished for the failure of governments else- 

 where to protect their elephants. And so they have a claim of 

 equitability that is hard not to respond to. Zimbabwe has done a 

 good job protecting their elephants. They have done a remarkable 

 job throughout southern Africa. So the southern African countries 



