44 



erything to an absolute standstill, which is what has happened in 

 our region. 



Mrs. Smith of Washington. Thank you, Mr. Geisinger. 



Ms. Phillips. Thank you, Mr. Geisinger. I appreciate your saying 

 I can speak for myself, and I will be extremely brief. 



Having not testified before, I forgot to say that I have submitted 

 things for the record, including three different packets which con- 

 tain what we consider really very bad sales in Washington State, 

 in Oregon, and in California under this plan and under the salvage 

 rider. I think if you have a chance to look through that at some 

 point in time, you will see why we are concerned about the Forest 

 Service and violations. I am sorry I forgot to say that before, but 

 thank you for this opportunity. 



Mrs. Smith of Washington. Thank you, Ms. Phillips. You just 

 think the administration is doing one crummy job of managing 

 this, and I guess I do, too. We certainly agree there. Thank you. 



Mrs. Chenoweth. [Presiding.] Thank you, Mrs. Smith. 



Mr. Riggs? 



Mr. Riggs. Thank you, Madam Chair. I do not know if I want 

 to say anything after that last comment, but it was very apropos 

 and, I believe, on the mark. 



Ms. Phillips, is it my understanding that you and the National 

 Audubon Society advocate a total repeal of the timber salvage 

 rider? 



Ms. Phillips. That is correct, sir. 



Mr. Riggs. Let me understand this, because Mr. Herger, I think, 

 was linking your organization with the Sierra Club, which I think 

 you 



Ms. Phillips. That is correct, and I am not a member of the Si- 

 erra Club. 



Mr. Riggs. Yet, if I understand correctly, you do not favor even 

 the harvesting of a dead, dying, or diseased tree, and if that is the 

 case, what form of commercial logging do you support on Federal 

 forest lands and how do you differ, then 



Ms. Phillips. Excuse me. I did not say- 



Mr. Riggs. Excuse me. Let me just finish the question. How do 

 you differ from the Sierra Club? 



Ms. Phillips. Since I am not a member of the Sierra Club and 

 since I really cannot explain their policies to you because I am not 

 a member, let me just explain National Audubon Society's view on 

 this as best I can. 



We are not — National Audubon Society is not against salvage 

 sales, and I think what we feel is that there are already laws in 

 place, environmental laws that had been instituted and passed by 

 Congress and signed by past Presidents that both protected our 

 natural resources and allowed citizen input into the public process. 

 Within those laws and the implementing regulations on the part of 

 the National Forest Service, they have been doing a salvage pro- 

 gram all along. A salvage program is not new for the Forest Serv- 

 ice. 



My Audubon Chapter, in particular, has never done an adminis- 

 trative appeal or litigation on a salvage sale. So I think if you take 

 a look at our record and check with the Mount Baker-Snoqualmie 

 National Forest, you will see that is our record. Our concern is that 



