157 



and as Dr. Ballard said, we cannot continue to be the leader in the 

 world in these areas if we have to implement up to 33 percent cuts. 



Now, Admiral Watkins, I think, outlined this very well. In 1982, 

 ocean sciences received about seven percent of the U.S. federal 

 basic research dollar. 



In 1996, that's going to be probably less than 3.8 percent. 



Dr. Baker, aren't you extremely worried about this, and are these 

 too deep of cuts? 



Dr. Baker. Yes, they are deep cuts and we are worried. We have 

 been trying to address that issue of getting adequate resource into 

 ocean research and into ocean management for a number of years. 

 We have been only partially successful in what you have seen. 



I think we're facing a real problem here. 



Mr. RoEMER. Where are they too deep, specifically? 



Dr. Baker. Well, you can look across NOAA and you can listen 

 to the other agencies, but we have three areas of oceans that are 

 particularly important to us. One is the area of the coastal zone. 

 And you do have an important coast in Indiana, a Great Lakes 

 coast. Coastal zone management. We have fisheries. And we have 

 the role of the ocean in weather and climate. 



All of these are areas that have a direct impact on our economy. 

 They're all areas where the more we know, the better job we do of 

 managing for economic growth. And yet, we simply don't have the 

 adequate resources to do the job. 



Now I recognize that we're all working under the balanced budg- 

 et limits. But I believe that it is very important for us both to try 

 to have a focus of resources in oceans, and also I think to try to 

 build stronger partnerships with the private sector. 



We see some very good opportunities in dealing with the private 

 sector, and as we go forward with any kind of arrangements, I 

 think it is very important to bring them in. 



This is one way, I think, in which we can help leverage the re- 

 sources that we have. 



Mr. Roemer. Admiral Watkins — I want to come back to some 

 partnerships. Maybe Admiral Boorda and you. Dr. Baker, can ad- 

 dress that. 



But Admiral Watkins, what is your opinion on the severity of 

 these cuts? 



Admiral Watkins. Well, having lived in the oceans for 37 years 

 in the Navy, both on it and under it, and having watched us win 

 the Cold War, in my opinion, because of our incredible science and 

 technology base in this country and what we did to lay out a strat- 

 egy against the Evil Empire that clearly brought them to their 

 knees, I know how powerful the oceans are — in transportation, in 

 the very threat of El Nino alone, for example, where NOAA has 

 done a tremendous job in giving us some kind of a model to predict. 



That's not just for coastal hazards and humans. That's also for 

 agriculture. It's also for water management. It's also for predicting 

 where is our airstream going to go in the winter months. 



Do we position our energy supplies properly? There's a whole 

 host of reasons why we need to know about an interannual or even 

 seasonal projection of climate. 



That's going to come from the oceans. There are very few people 

 in this country that understand that oceans drive the climate, i^d 



