158 



in the Arctic, the heartpump of the world, we know very Httle 

 about it. 



The Navy probably knows more about the Arctic than any other 

 community. 



We need to share that data. We need to get it out. We need to 

 really understand it, or we're not going to know what natural vari- 

 ability is in all this clamor here on Capitol Hill on whether it's sin- 

 thropogenic or not, whether it's man-created. 



We're got to really understand nature, and we don't. We've un- 

 derserved the nation's oceans for a long time. We are in a malaise 

 because the Evil Empire was driving 40 percent of the entire in- 

 vestment in R&D and the oceans within the Navy. 



Now that's not the case. The^ve been cut in half. The/re only 

 20 percent now. NSF has the largest portion of the responsibility. 



So we have to regroup our thinking. 



And I think it's very important that we listen to people like the 

 National Academy of Sciences, who just put out a report, and I 

 think that Bruce Alberts talked about it today. Allocating federal 

 funds for science and technology. 



And what they're saying is, let's have a new way of doing busi- 

 ness about this. Let's don't talk about R&D and put it together at 

 a $70-billion level for the Federal Government when we're putting 

 $14 billion into research, not $70 billion. A lot of that is "D," it's 

 not "R." 



And so we have to understand what we're doing here. A lot of 

 that is test and development in the military. Very important. I'm 

 not degrading that. But we have to understand what we're doing. 



And they're saying, let's tell Congress what we're doing in 

 science and technology and let's get into themes that we want to 

 be pre-eminent in the world in. 



And this is one of them, in my opinion. 



Mr. ROEMER. I would interpret your answer to say that you're 

 very concerned about these. 



Admiral W^ATKINS. Strong letter follows, yes. 



[Laughter.] 



Mr. RoEMER. Good. Let me ask a follow-up question. 



We've heard very good testimony about what some of these re- 

 search vessels have been able to accomplish, what satellites have 

 been able to accomplish. 



Dr. Ballard talked about JASON and ARGO, although they 

 might not fall into the same category in terms of cost. The ones 

 that I mentioned up front are very costly and expensive tech- 

 nologies. 



How do we better coordinate these disparate services so, as Ad- 

 miral Boorda talked about cooperation in the academic life and in 

 our university life, how do we come up with enough capital funding 

 to continue to buy satellites, to buy research vessels, to produce the 

 next generation of JASONs and ARGOs? 



What ideas might the panel have in that area? Let me start with 

 you. Dr. Ballard. 



Dr. Ballard. Well, in fact, development of the ARGO/JASON 

 system was a Cold War development effort. It v/as funded by the 

 United States Navy, the Office of Naval Research, the Office of 

 Naval Technology, and tremendously augmented by the operational 



