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were talking about on things atomic. They really did — the Jacksons 

 and those people were terrific. And the chairmen of the committees 

 over here that were members of that joint committee, they were 

 powerful and they moved things. 



So if we want to move something, then at least at some point the 

 kind of notables that you have up here today, the top agency heads 

 coming before you and talking about it in broad terms is critically 

 important as those 47 subcommittees — appropriations and author- 

 izations and so forth — review those individual programs, and we 

 ought to star those things that are cross-cutting. 



And please don't take them out over in one committee to save a 

 dollar when, in fact, you impact on all nine of us, and the academic 

 institutions in the process. 



So I believe that — I don't know about the aquatic institute. I 

 haven't reviewed that. I don't really understand it yet. I'd have to 

 understand that. But I believe there are things we need to do now 

 while weighing the debate on that kind of an approach, the NIH 

 equivalent, if you will. That could come a little later, I think, and 

 it needs a lot of thought and a lot of addressing on how that would 

 work. 



I just haven't reviewed that proposed legislation. 



I think what we're talking about is something in FY '96 to pre- 

 pare for the FY '97 budget, where we can say to you, we need cer- 

 tain access to data that we share, all nine agencies share, and the 

 academic institutions contribute to and the private sector needs. 



We have needs in the area of people and education that are 

 cross-cutting across all these things. We need people in marine pol- 

 icy. We can't throw away our master's degree in oceanography as 

 we do today. We need them in industry. 



So we need your help in just a simple way. If you'll just agree 

 to do this once a year, you'll go a long way. 



Mr. Gilchrist. I think we want to agree to do this once a year. 

 I think we're touching on maybe the heart of the problem and Dr. 

 Frosch touched on it a little bit before, about we have all this 

 science out here and we have all of this knowledge. We have all 

 of this expertise here. 



And if we said this was going to be a hearing on Whitewater or 

 the travel office, the place would be filled with reporters and filled 

 with cameras. And yet, that has absolutely nothing to do with the 

 survival of the planet. 



And here we have one of the most important topics that we can 

 even discuss, and you don't even see a lot of members here. 



Dr. Frosch made a comment about you have all of this science. 

 How do you get it to the planning and zoning commissioner of a 

 particular town that lives on the coast so he doesn't have construc- 

 tion take place on a critical spawning area for certain kinds of fish? 



They don't ever get. 



I had a lot of questions, too, and I want to make a comment 

 about how NOAA and the Navy coordinates their activities with 

 their fleet and how important the NOAA fleet is with the naval 

 vessels that are doing similar research. 



But I think what is critical for us here, and I think you've hit 

 the nail on the head, we don't need a lot more legislation that's 

 going to get lost in the archives of the Library of Congress. But our 



