29 



The Chairman. Well, the purpose of that question is that one of 

 the problems we have, as I think the gentleman from Tennessee 

 put it very well, is this idea that the government knows all and is 

 best of all and why there is not some working cooperation between 

 the State fish and game. And I know in your career, I think at one 

 time, there was a difference as to what was considered a baited 

 field; maybe that is why they do not 



Mr. Pelham. Yes, sir. I used to work baited fields, but it was 

 when you walked on the field, and you found the bait. They would 

 not document a field. And by documenting that, I mean the receiv- 

 ing of information anonymously or even by name that a particular 

 field was baited. This, they found, led to nefarious political activity, 

 if you will, just by the mere placing of this bait on the field and 

 then calling the law enforcement in when the hunt began, and boy, 

 you have got a violation of the law. 



The Chairman. My time is gone. Just, young man, I want to tell 

 you maybe you ought to stay out of ag. I know what your major 

 is. Unfortunately, you might make a good lawyer. 



Mr. Clemons. My major is agricultural education. I will be 

 teaching young people conservative methods about our resources. 



The Chairman. That is very good. I just think, you know, to go 

 forward and represent yourself is very good. 



Senator, I do not have any questions at this time. I will have 

 maybe after the second round. Same thing for you. Sheriff. 



The gentleman from Minnesota? 



Mr. Vento. Well, I think that obviously, trying to raise money 

 for good causes is great. It is just unfortunate that things unfolded. 

 The thing that sort of surprises me is that the confrontation here 

 is sort of between the Fish and Wildlife Service, or, for that matter, 

 it could be the Florida Fish and Game. I mean, as I said, in my 

 area, they work pretty closely. They are all enforcing the same law, 

 and I assume that they would do it as evenhandedly as the Fish 

 and Wildlife Service did it. 



But the focus seems to be whose responsibility is it. Number one, 

 it obviously is the responsibility of whoever lets you use that field 

 after manipulating the habitat and vegetation. That is a problem. 

 Have any of you taken any suits or action against the individuals 

 who actually own the field, who let you use it, who actually manip- 

 ulated it in that way which caused you this problem? 



Senator, have you taken any action? 



Mr. Williams. I have not. I have talked to him on several occa- 

 sions since then. He still declares to this day that the field was not 

 baited. I was in the field; saw no bait. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife 

 Service says they have evidence of it. And there again, you have 

 to understand it was a 240-acre field. To this day, we do not know 

 where the bait was found, what kind of bait, what it was, where, 

 so forth and so on. 



Mr. Vento. I appreciate that, but the fact is that there has been 

 no determination of that. But obviously, that could have been pur- 

 sued by pursuing a single case to demonstrate it. There was one 

 case pursued, but that was on a different field. So, that did not es- 

 tablish that. So, that is a case for a court to decide, frankly. I do 

 not^ think any of us, given the type of information — I mean, I have 

 been on the bad side of — not necessarily with fish and game laws. 



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