232 CONFERENCE ON NATURAL BEAUTY 



got to indicate to the Bureau its reasons for divergence from the opin- 

 ion of the conservation agency. This divergence must satisfy the Bu- 

 reau of Public Roads. If it does not, we will have to disapprove the 

 project. 



Mr. HARTZOG. With respect to the specific area mentioned by the 

 questioner, Secretary Udall has written the State in connection with 

 this proposed location expressing the concern of the department. 

 We work very closely with the BPR in these matters and, as a matter 

 of fact, Rex Whitton has issued memoranda requiring that the con- 

 servation agencies be considered on these questions on these inter- 

 state arguments. I think we are making progress. It is a difficult 

 area. 



Certainly, we recognize that we are going to have these differences. 

 I have a great deal of confidence in Rex Whitton and his sensitivity 

 to these problems and I believe that great progress has been made in 

 the last few years. 



Dr. CLARENCE COTTAM. I am wondering if the answer to part of 

 this last question wouldn't be legislation? For 25 years we had an an- 

 nual scrap to keep a four-lane highway out of Rock Creek Park. It is 

 a current proposition. The argument we heard was if you get any 

 Federal property, why not use it for public purposes? Yet a parkway 

 would completely defeat the purpose for which those areas are ac- 

 quired. It seems to me there ought to be some areas out of bounds 

 for public road development. This could be turned into an eight- 

 lane highway. 



Mr. HARTZOG. I think you are absolutely right. I think this is 

 one of the things that certainly is involved in this, that park land is 

 looked on as free land and can be devoted to highways. 



Now, we have been talking to the Bureau of Public Roads, par- 

 ticularly with Mr. Whitton, about this. Because very recently in 

 St. Louis, and also in Jackson County, Mo., they paid for park land 

 and it was reimbursed under the Interstate Highway Act. I think 

 if the true costs of these park lands are taken into account in the 

 highway rights-of-way, that perhaps we will minimize the impact of 

 these arguments. 



If it is an absolute necessity that the park land be devoted to a 

 highway purpose, and the highway department is required to replace 

 this in kind or in cash an equivalent payment of park land I think 

 you would really begin to get at the root of the problem. The 



