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AMERICAN BEE JOURNAL 



Nov. 7, lyi 1. 



F. J. Miller — Do I understand that it 

 is simply the McEvoy treatment for 

 foul brood? 



Mr. Stewart — With the difference 

 that we recommend being on the safe 

 side by disinfecting the hive by boiling 

 or the use of some strong disinfectant. 

 Mr. Case — How can you manage to 

 get the bees from the combs or the 

 starters on which you first shake them, 

 on to the foundation that you are go- 

 ing to leave them on, without their 

 killing themselves with the honey that 

 is ted? 



Mr. Stewart — That is a chance you 

 have to take. Of course, it would, per- 

 haps, be better to confine them in a 

 box in the cellar until they have thor- 

 oughly used up the honey in their 

 honey-sacs, and then put them on comb 

 foundation. Of course, you will, occa- 

 sionally, but the chance is small, have 

 a colony infected by taking honey even 

 a second time; that is why we use a 

 second treatment, in order to do away 

 with all the germs in the honey, and 

 usually are successful, although once 

 in a great while there may be an ex- 

 ceptional case; so, perhaps, it would be 

 better to confine them in a box in the 

 cellar for 48 hours, or something like 

 that. 



N. N. Betzinger, of New York — They 

 usually retain the honey that they take 

 with them 14 days before they let go 

 of it. 



Mr. Callbreath— What time of the 

 year is best for treatment? Should the 

 same treatment be given when they 

 are gathering honey, as when they are 

 not gathering honey? 



Mr. Stewart — The better time is 

 when they are gathering honey. In 

 that case we recommend using some- 

 thing like formaldehide in the honey. 

 Mr. McEvoy— I think that Mr. Stew- 

 art and I could agree on most points, 

 but speaking of putting the bees into 

 the cellar for four days, it kind of un- 

 fits them for business; they become 

 lean and poor and have to be built up 

 by feeding afterwards to get them into 

 good condition. The four days upon 

 the starters, and after that the new 

 foundation will answer every purpose. 

 There is nothing like feeding the bees: 

 give them plenty. 



Mr. Stewart — Yes, I do. 

 Mr. West — There is one thing in re- 

 gard to this black-brood business, and 

 with the treatment, and the shaking 

 the first and second time, that I think 

 is a little different in some cases 

 from what it is with the real, old-time 

 foul brood. Our black brood, when 

 shaken the first time and let remain 

 four days, and then shake them again, 

 and put them on foundation, I find in 

 the hands of other people who are do- 

 ing this work, that the bees are very 

 reluctant about staying in their hives 

 so many times, and swarm out and 

 sometimes go to the woods, and if this 

 is done in the swarming season, when 

 bees are swarming, they may swarm 

 with other colonies that have a young 

 queen, notwithstanding that these bees 

 may have their queen caged. Notwith- 

 standing all this, when other swarms 

 issue, it has a tendency to draw these 

 bees out of the hives and they unite on 

 the wing and mix with other bees and 

 thereby spread the disease to other 

 hives. Now, I prefer, with a good 

 many men that haven 't real experience, 

 to put them into the cellar and continue 

 to feed them for four or five days. And 



when I shake them on foundation and 

 put them into the cellar for fouror five 

 days and feed them while they are 

 there, I have had very good results this 

 year; and if strange bees are put to- 

 gether, it improves the work, and I find, 

 too, that the colony does better when 

 treated in the swarming-time, if it is 

 moved from the apiary some ten or 

 twelve rods, out of the reach of the 

 others. It is best, in my experience, 

 to cure this disease in the swarming 

 season, or when you have a continuous 

 flow of honey, and if the colony, after 

 shaking, has been carried off some ten 

 or twelve rods from the rest of the 

 apiary, when swarms from the apiary 

 come out, the others are less inclined 

 to leave the hive, and, if they do, and 

 the queen is caged or clipped, they re- 

 turn without spreading the disease. 



Mr. McEvoy — I agree with Mr. West 

 on that point, when he puts them in 

 the cellar he feeds them. 



THE USE OF COMB FO0ND.\TION. 



" Is the use of foundation profitable 

 in the production of comb and ex- 

 tracted honey ?" 



F. Greiner. of New York — I would 

 say that it is undoubtedly profitable to 

 use comb foundation, in the production 

 of comb honey as well as extracted 

 honey, and the question in my mind 

 is. Do we produce as good an article of 

 comb honey with comb foundation as 

 we could without? That is the only 

 point why I hesitate sometimes in ad- 

 vocating and using comb foundation 

 in sections. I have used the very best 

 comb foundation that could be pro- 

 cured; and yet I will say that I did not 

 use the flat-bottom foundation — there 

 might be a difference in favor of that. 

 I have used the regular comb founda- 

 tion as it is manufactured by other 

 manufacturers. I can detect the comb 

 foundation in almost all my comb 

 honey, and my wife very seriously ob- 

 jects to my using comb honey or bring- 

 ing such in the house for use, on 

 account of this comb foundation. 

 Otherwise, I should say it was profit- 

 able to use. Of course, in the produc- 

 tion of extracted honey, if you don't 

 have the combs there is no other way. 

 If you have not the combs, the way to 

 do is to use comb foundation. 



Dr. Mason — Wouldn't the bees build 

 it if they didn't have any? 



Mr. Greiner — They would, but it 

 would not be as profitable, and we want 

 as tough comb as possible. In the 

 brood-chamber certainly it is profitable 

 in more than one way to use comb 

 foundation. You get splendid combs, 

 and a good deal quicker, and the drones 

 are excluded almost entirely; but there 

 is no other way that we can prohibit 

 the rearing of drones than by this 

 method. 



Dr. Miller— I don't doubt at all the 

 importance of the question. I do doubt 

 the advisability of taking much time in 

 discussing the reasons for the differ- 

 ences of opinion. It occurs to me that 

 if we could have two or three intelli- 

 gent questions asked and simply get 

 opinions how many think so and so; 

 and it occurs to me that if Mr. Hutchin- 

 son, who has digested the whole mat- 

 ter pretty thoroughly, would put the 

 different questions that are required, 

 and ask us where we will put ourselves 

 on record, I believe it would be of use. 

 Simply get the number of those who 



think they want to use foundation, and 

 so on. 



Mr. Hutchinson — Is it profitable in 

 working for extracted honey, to hive 

 swarms upon full sheets of foundation 

 in the brood-nest? How many would 

 favor hiving swarms on full sheets of 

 foundation in the brood-nest when 

 working for extracted honey? Evi- 

 dently, most of us use full sheets. How 

 many would use full sheets for comb 

 honey? How many would use starters? 

 Is there any one here who would use 

 starters in the supers only? 



Mr. West — I would use starters, but 

 I would make a half sheet of it by 

 using it saw-tooth fashion. 



Mr. Hutchinson — How many would 

 fill their sections full of foundation? 

 You see most of us would put in full 

 sheets of foundation. Is there any 

 one here that would allow the bees to 

 build their surplus combs in producing 

 extracted honey? 



Mr. Wilcox — The foundation costs 

 me nearly a dollar a hive, and by using 

 a few sheets of foundation starters they 

 will build a few combs, and it is more 

 economical in the brood-chamber. I 

 use old combs in the supers. 



Mr. Betsinger — I voted for using full 

 sheets of foundation in the sections. 

 Now, I don't know anything more 

 about it than before I voted. The 

 question is why I use them. 



Mr. West — We haven't got the time 

 to tell why. We have got to take the 

 expression in this way. 



Mr. Hutchinson — I fill them full in 

 my locality, because they can finish 

 the combs so much quicker and take 

 care of the harvest. I think if the 

 honey-flow was slow it might be profit- 

 able to allow them to build combs in 

 the sections, but when it comes in with 

 a rush, and they can fill the super in 

 three days, they haven't the time to 

 build the combs and gather the honey, 

 and for that reason' it is profitable to 

 use foundation, because they can get 

 storage room quicker; but I have found 

 it profitable not to use full sheets of 

 foundation in the broodnest when hiv- 

 ing swarms and working for comb 

 honey, in my locality. I have taken 

 the sections off the old hive and put 

 them on the new, and have the same 

 bees working in the sections again in 

 20 minutes, with all the enthusiasm of 

 a new swarm, and all the honey that 

 goes in must go up in those sections, 

 and they will build brood-combs, and 

 as fast as they build the queen will fill 

 them with eggs, and I have gotten as 

 nice honey as by allowing them to 

 build their own surplus combs. But, 

 as far as results are concerned in sur- 

 plus honey, I can get more by allowing 

 them to build their own combs in the 

 brood-nest. I would confine a swarm 

 to about five combs. 



Mr. Abbott — As we seem to be estab- 

 lishing a precedent, I want to express 

 my opinion about this voting business. 

 It seems to me like school-boy play. I 

 cannot see anything to gain by it, can- 

 not see any instruction to be gotten 

 out of it, and I cannot see any good in 

 it — a lot of people holding up their 

 hands that they would do this and that. 

 A National beekeepers' meeting, it 

 seems to me, is to impart instruction 

 and information at the same time, and 

 to hear from these people who are not 

 in the habit of talking. I want to hear 

 Dr. Miller and we want to see him. 

 Dr. Miller— I think there are certain 



