OLEOMARGARINE. 253 



Mr. SCHELL. Then you do not agree that it shall be sold on its mer- 

 its, without a 10-cent tax ? 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. No, sir; not colored. [Laughter.] 



Mr. DAVIS. It will not be sold on its merits. 



Mr. SCHELL. We want to get these gentlemen on record either as 

 saying that if such a law can be enforced 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. Now, I say 



The ACTING CHAIRMAN. One at a time, gentlemen. 



Mr. SCHELL. I have the floor now, and I think the chairman will 

 bear me out in saying that I have observed the courtesy of debate 

 right along. 



The ACTING CHAIRMAN. Yes, that is true. Mr. Schell has the floor, 

 and should not be interrupted. 



Mr. SCHELL. We want you gentlemen on record either as being in 

 favor of an absolute extermination of colored oleomargarine, except 

 under heavy penalties, or we want you on record as being in favor of 

 having colored oleomargarine sold on its merits for what it is. We 

 want you on one side of the fence or the other. 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. Now, I am going to answer that question. 



Mr. SCHELL. That is what we want. 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. We simply say that no possible law or regulation 

 can be made to prevent the sale of colored oleomargarine as butter. 



Mr. SCHELL. But if it can? 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. Let me answer. I say it is impossible to pass any 

 law 



Mr. DRENNAN. We have been trying for twenty years to do that, 

 Mr. Schell. 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. Let me answer the question. He simply asked 

 whether, if a regulation could be made to prevent the sale of colored 

 oleomargarine except under restrictions, we would object to it. I say 

 that that "if" is an impossible thing. No law or regulation can be 

 made to prevent the sale of colored oleomargarine as and for butter. 

 I do not care what your penalties are. Therefore, because of the 

 impossibility of selling colored oleomargarine under restrictions, we 

 ask that if colored oleomargarine shall be sold at all, the manufacturer 

 shall pay 10 cents a pound tax upon it, so as to make the expense of 

 the article so much more. 



Mr. SCHELL. You are not willing, then, that it shall be sold on its 

 merits alone, unencumbered by this tax of 10 cents a pound? 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. We say that colored oleomargarine is an imitation 

 and a fraud, and therefore we 



Mr. GROUT. You are willing that it should be sold, though, if its sale 

 could be so regulated as to prevent its being sold for butter? 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. If it could, yes; but that is impossible. 



Mr. GROUT. That is it exactly. As long as there is a temptation of 

 150 per cent profit on the cost of production, it will be impossible. 



Mr. SCHELL. Well, General Grout, we know 



Mr. GROUT. That is why you want your tax? 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. Yes, sir. 



Mr. GROUT. You want to take away the temptation ? 



Mr. KAUFFMAN. That is it, exactly. 



Mr. GROUT. If you do not, you can not do it. 



Mr. SCHELL. There is just one other question I want to ask here, 

 and that is this: Would you and your clients be willing that this pres- 



