so 



ROTAL COMMISSION ON AiiUK I Ml i;i . 



1919.] 



MR. M. 1). BANM : i i I - I 



niifil. 



well, the chanors are that the farmers will continue 

 to go in for stork breeding or lay their hind do n to 

 gran, but they corutiuly ill not, go on with . 

 I think -ho\\ mi i>i|til pi. 



nearly an equal profit to milk, th. luimcr will i;i" 

 cereal* because the milk business m- <U a very . 

 deal more personal intention irom tin- MI-HUT then 

 the growing of corn does. As you know, probably as 

 well a* I do, if a farmer hag a lot of cons he has to 

 give them endless attention. The difficulty of get- 

 ting then milked properly has been very acute during 

 the war. A large number of pur best hands have 

 gone. They are gradually coming back, but many 

 of thorn unfortunately will never come back and it in 

 a question of more or less training many of ih. -.- 

 men, however willing they may be to learn, how to 

 become good cowmen. 



:. Do vou think it is really worth while keep- 

 ig some of this land in cultivation. Take No. 1. for 

 instance, producing 2$ quarters per acre? I do not 

 think it is. I think it can be turned to better use 

 for cattle than for corn. 



I did not quite follow what vou said in rejiK 

 ;.> Mi I'autK'v with regard to the extraordinary 

 difficulty you have had in Sussex with laliour? We 

 have had the same difficult. e> in farming' a> of ronr-e 

 have been experienced in every other industry. It is 

 no use saying there has not Wen a very great denl 

 of unrest "not only among labour, but amongst every- 

 body, and the unfortunate fanner ha.s had the share 

 of the unrest amongst his labourers as well as tiny- 

 body else. 



6916. Would YOU not say that the farmers In Kast 

 Suasex are to some extent responsible for the unrest? 

 No, I do not think BO. 



5917. Are you aware that the whole of the I 

 Mjss.-x fanners have resigned from the Sussex Wages 

 Committee? I heard so the other day. 



5914. Without any consultation with their col- 

 leagues of West Sussex, although they sit on Ihe 

 same Board? I understand they have," but I do not 

 know. 



5019. I suppose you read the Sussex papers? Yes. 



6920. You must have read some extraordinary 

 statements by the East Sussex farmers about the 

 Government and the labourers and everybody else 

 connected with agriculture? Of course one 

 articles abusing everybody else. Whatever paper you 

 look at vou find one side abusing the other side. 



6921. Would you be surprised to hear that n West 

 Sussex there have not been these extraordinary diffi- 

 culties? Yes, I should, from what some of the West 



farmers told m not very long ap>. 



5922. Mr. Ihtnrnn: On what principle did you 

 these fields in respect of which you have esti- 

 mated the coat of production in your Tables? I took 

 farms where I had made valuations and in n spect of 

 which I had the annual cultivations already recorded 

 in my books before I was aaked to go into tin- niie, 

 t ion;* so that I knew there was no possibility of ili> 

 farmer giving me cultivat'ons which he had not done. 

 That i* why I selected these particular fields. 



6933. Would these five fields covering a distance of 

 l.'i miles give a fair idea of the cost of cultivation 

 of wheat over the whole area ? Over the whole area 

 it would. 



6924. Are we to tnkn it that these five instances are 

 |.|.li< able generally to the area? The average of 

 them i applicable to the average of the whole area. 



5911. When you stated that n guaranteed price- of 

 ). n* neewwiry in your opinion, is that based on 

 the average of the whole area? --Yes. The difficulty 

 I tee in a guaranteed price of Sf>. is that on the good 

 land it will invariably show a good profit, whereas on 

 poor land it will not. 



8996. When you suggest a guarantee of 80s., is 

 that with the object of keeping the poorer land in 

 i nltivntion ' I would not say the poorer land, but the 

 average land. 



6027. I)o you think from your experience that it 

 i* dmirnbh* froin the point of view of agriculture to 

 keep land requiring a guarantee of 80s. in cultiva- 

 tion for ' think so. if vou want, to produce 

 anything approaching a reasonable i|ii.intity of wheat 

 in England to feed the imputation I look upon it 

 that the wh^le thing r<*tx again on whether or not 

 we are eoing to import wheat or grow it 



' \>u think the figure of 80s. is applicable 

 mly to your district or that we should apply it more 

 widely: I should not like to give an opinion beyond 

 AH threo counties, Surrey, Sussex, and Kent. 



'ion think it necessary in tli.- three <. 

 and that nothing less would keep such land in culti- 

 vation? I do not think anything loss-would keep the 

 average land in cultivation. 



693" -ate that farmers are putting down 



their land to grass and going in for breeding? Yes. 

 I . Would a guarantee of 80s. keep them from 

 going in for breeding and induce them to keep their 

 land in cultivation for cereals? I think it would in 

 the case of many of them. 



5932. Mr. Edwards: You say you are selling or 

 about to sell your dairy stock and that farmers are 

 going in for pedigree breeding? Yes. 



8. Do you think that the fact that by selling 

 their stock they "an realise a profit at the present 

 timo which they could not otherwise get hnld of has 

 anything to do with their decision? I do not fancy 

 w>. Of course, it is no use disguising the fact that 

 if you cash your farm stock now you are cashing it 

 at a very high price which mny, or may nut last ; 

 it is a matter of opinion whether it will last or not. 



5934. You do admit that n farmer who sells off 

 hid stock at the present moment will got hold of a 

 large sum of money by way of profit which might bi> 

 lost to him in, say, five or ten years' time? 



"ifll"). Is there much land being sold in your areaP 

 \ i remendouB lot. 



.5036. Do you think that the game reason holds 

 good in the case of land also, that people arc ailing 

 their land now because they arc able to cash the 

 value which might be lost in a short time? I think 

 they are selling it partly because there is not now 

 the same social status attached to owning land that 

 there was. and partly because the average landlord 

 is responsible for all materiel, external repairs, and 

 in many rases the internal repairs as well, and the 

 cost of labour and materials has gone up so very 

 mu'-h that at the price, at which one can sHI land 

 say at nearly 20 years' purchase whereat the average 

 land has not boon producing more than some 3 per 

 cent, in the. past. Therefore, if there are no social 

 amenities attached to the ownership of land one gete 

 out and goes into other seruriti. 



5037. Mr. Grrrn: There is a great variety of soil 

 in the county of Sussex, and that accounts perhaps for 

 M-at diversity there is in these costing accounts? 

 Yes. 



J, Have you anv estimates of the yield and the 

 cost in the wonderful wheat belt south of Chicheste-r? 



Vo. T have not any farms down there on which I 

 make annual valuations. 



,vi.T>. 1 S M;'L-est that a guarantee of 80s. a (|iiartor 

 t i a farmer on the Chichester l>rick earth would mean 

 enormous profits to him?-- Yes. T should think he 

 would do very well : T should be very pleased to farm 

 these at that prirr. 



i We have- heard n great deal about the poor 



Wealdon el ay from Mr. Cautloy. Would it surprise 



vou if I were to take you to a farm of 250 acres on 



that Wealden clay, of 'which the farmer cnme up 'JO 



ago from Devonshire with 100 in his pocket. 



He died during the war-time and left 5,000 in cash. 



IN put five sons into farms of 200 to 300 acres, and 



three d:ni"hters on to a VJfl acre farm. Since his 



father died during the war. his son. who took on Ins 



father's farm of 250 acres, has iKnieht that farm and 



he farm occupied by the three sisters. I wonder 



vhether that would surprise you?- T am not quite 



luit I fancy T acted in connection with that 



fnrm : T am not certain. T think T know the farm yon 



are referring to. 



.YM I. You think my statement is correct? I think 

 so, and T know a similar case if T do not know that 

 identical one. 



IS. Rome of these estimates you have given arc 

 in respect of farms upon the thin chalk. T supi 

 Yes. 



,V>13. Would yon say as a general proposition, that 



the farmers on the chalk could not pay such high 



hose who are on the C'hichester wheat belt'- 



T should sav thev could not. 



