40 



ROYAL COMMISSION ON AGRICULTURE. 



1919.] 



MK. THOMAS C. GOODWIN. 



work of tho County ol (.huahiro u dono through 

 the atnall holders, who do all the work themselves and 

 do not work eight hours a day but 16. In many 

 ciiei farmers hare three or four sons or daughters, 

 and they all help in the dairy work. That ia where 

 the increase has come, to a large extent, daring the 

 past year or two I think. Farmers and their sons 

 and daughters hare done their utmost in the dairying 

 industry to produce all they possibly could. That, in 

 my opinion, is where the increase has come, and not 

 from the labour employed and paid. 



6162. In paragraph (h) you refer to a co-operative 

 movement :- Yes. 



6163. Do you mean by that there ought to be more 

 co-operation amongst the farming community from 

 the point of view of even buying and selling? Yes. 



6164. Would you extend that to the use of machinery 

 also? --Do you mean in the purchase of machinery? 



6165. Yes? Certainly, in the purchase of machinery. 



6166. And the use o'f it? Yea. 



6167. You think it would be a good thing for the 

 industry? Yes. The tendency is in that direction all 

 the time. 



6163. Have you any other suggestion to make to the 

 Commission as to anything that might be beneficial 

 or helpful to the industry from the point of view of 

 improvement? I think that the chief hope for agri- 

 culture is in the method I have suggested co-opera- 

 tion among the farmers themselves in dealing with 

 their own produce and bringing it to the consumer 

 without the extra expense on it of the middleman, 

 still reserving the personal element in the farming. 

 If you get co-operation on somewhat different lines 

 in connection with the industrial co-operative socie- 

 ties, and you get bailiffs or managers put into the 

 farms where the co-operative societies buy up the 

 estates, and that sort of thing, it nearly always follows 

 that you get a decreased production because you 

 drive out some of the better farmers and the personal 

 element on the farms. The better farmers do not stay 

 on as managers under the C.W.S. 



6169. Could you give us any particular instances 

 of what you have in your mind? We have one or two 

 farms in our district that arc now farmed by the 

 C.W.S. where the production has very much de- 

 creased and the farms have very much deteriorated. 



6170. In your neighbourhood? In my neighbour- 

 hood as a result of managers being put in. Of course 

 you never get quite the same man under that system. 



6171. Have you any other suggestions? No, I have 

 no other that I can state just straight off. 



6172. Apart from co-operation you have no other 

 suggestions to make? No, not just at the moment. 



6173. What about transport? The question of 

 transport will be dealt with by Mr. Sadler. I do 

 not want to touch upon questions that ho will deal 

 with, hut I think there is great improvement possible 

 in connection with transport. 



6174. Mr. Smith: To go to your paragraph where 

 you speak of the lack of interest on the part of the 

 farm labourer, is it a growing feature? It has 

 been very much more noticable in the last year or so, 

 especially in the last nine months. 



6175. Is there a tendency for men to lose interest in 

 the industry? That is what it appears to us to be 

 to some extent. 



6176. Do they leave the industry? Do you mean 

 leave the industry to go to towns P 



6177. YcsP Yes, in some cases we get them leaving 

 to go to the towns. 



6178. You have largo industrial centres in close 

 proximity to you, have you not? Yen. 



6179. I was wondering whether the lack of interest 

 in agriculture which you suggest was duo to the fact 

 that there are other nttr., <:!> \\hich take tin nn ;. 

 away from the industry:- Of course where 1 nin now. 

 I am close to Crcwe, the great railway works, and I 

 think there is something of the 'kind in that 

 immediate neighbourhood, but as a matter of fact, as 

 far as labour iUwlf is concerned I think there has been 

 more trouble and unrest in other parts of the county 

 away from the industrial centres. 



6180. Would that be because of dissatisfaction an 

 applied to the industry it> If'- 1 . T do not think that. 

 I think perhaps in Crewe they are able to get a little 



uioii- money m bomo cant* and they do uot value the 

 extra that they would get when they arc employed 

 mi the farms. 



0161. Theru must be BOUIO explanation of this luck 

 of interest, and I am rather anxious to know what it 

 is whether it is due to an attraction by oihei -mlu- 

 tries which tempts the men away from agriculture, 

 and therefore does not impress weir minds with the 

 necessity of looking upon agriculture .is their life's, 

 work, or whether it is due to borne other reason? I 

 think one of the chief attractions is the fact that 

 they have the week-ends to themselves and they have 

 not any Sunday work in the industrial centres that 

 is one of the chief attractions whLh diuu.s the men 



:.uay. 



6182. Do you think therefore it would help the in- 

 dustry if the labour conditions were made as good as 

 possible in order to retain the workmen and retain 

 their interest? I believe it is all to the benefit of 

 the industry that we should pay the best wages we 

 possibly can and make tho conditions as good as they 

 can be made. 



6183. Do you think this matter of interest is due to 

 the abnormal circumstances, through which the nation 

 has passed? I think that has something to do with 

 it. 



6184. Therefore in that respect it may be only tem- 

 porary? Yes, it may be only teiii|x>rary. 



6185. Coining to the figures yon have set out here 

 it looks as though the rent of the land must have in- 

 creased very substantially. I do not know whether 

 we are comparing the same figures, but take example 

 2 rent and rates on the main crop of potatoes. 

 1 8s. and example 1, which is 2 10s. 3d. P That is 

 owing to the fact that these are taken on my own 

 farms. In 1916, I was farming tho large farm of 764 

 acres at lees rent than the one I am farming now a 

 different rent altogether. 



618C. This is not a comparative statement on thu 

 same farm? No, it is the costs as they presented 

 themselves to me on the two different farms. 



6187. That makes it rather difficult to compare 

 these figures to get a proper comparison. It ought to 

 have been on the same farm, because the conditions 

 might be quite different on the two farms as to soil 

 .-uul things of that kind? It would not have been 

 fair for me to put the rent the same when I was on 

 a different farm at a less rent. 



6188. If it is a statement of fact nobody could take 

 exception to it. My point is that to make a com- 

 parison one would naturally conclude this referred to 

 tin same farm? No, it does not refer to the same, 

 farm, but that only makes practically one point differ- 

 ent. The greater increase conies from other factors. 



6189. 1 2s. 6d. increase per acre from the point 

 of view of rent is a rather substantial increase? If 

 I had put the rent the same on the light land farms 

 it would have made the result worse, bwMM tho cost 

 of producing on the lighter land is heavier than on 

 the heavier lands for certain particular crops. 



6190. What are we to understand by the term 

 "drilling" in this potato cr<>|.:- That is drilling 

 the drills out ridging if you like. You have to ridge 

 the- land first; then the manure is put on, and then 

 the potatoes are dropped, and then the artificials, 

 and then it is split end covered. 



6191. I could not exactly gather if that was you- 

 method by the use of the term " drilling " Then 

 later on you state, " boxing, holeing and planting." 

 The up-to-date method is to have all your potato 

 seta boxed. The holeing is done by an impttmaat 

 \\hieh we have for going down the drills and making 

 the holes and putting the seed in and keeping it in 

 rows with exactly even distances apart and of tho 

 .Mine depth. 



6192. The usual method is to drop the potato in as 

 you go along out of a bRket?^That is out of date; 

 that is not an up-to-date potato-growing method. 



'. I only want to know what these terms mean? 



This is the piaitiee adopted in all tin- up to date 

 I'otato growing districts, because you get an e\. 

 Ol depth and an equal distance between, and straight 

 rows. 



6194. I suppose the increase in labour would be one 

 of the substantial items causing a difference in the 

 figure*?- Yes. 



