,*/, U'l'.t.j 



U'-VAI. iOMMIl"N OH AGRICULTURE. 

 MIL J. SAIU.RK. 



[Continued. 





7056. Mi. /.'u: In the firat part of jour evidence, 

 yon raise the difficulty of following out the milk in- 

 dustry under the new system of nouns and so on. 

 That of course has tendency i.. im lease the cost of 

 production ? Yes. 



7057. And consequently a tandaMj)) to tower the 

 profit* of the dairy farmers?- Yes. 



7036. On the figures that have been put before us 

 this afternoon, those protiU do not any 



means to be exhorbitant, as matters are!'- They are 

 difficult to find. 



7009. Will there be a danger, do you think, of many 

 men going out of the Industry P are going out 



7060. Do you find that in Cheshire now? Yes. 



7061. Throughout the war, have not they been 

 making fair profits on the whole:' Oh, yes. 



7062. As other farmers have:-- Yes. 



7063. That is an agreed fact:- Yes, 1 think there 

 is no doubt about that, but nothing like the enormous 

 profits they are credited with. 



7064. That is the next question I was going to ask 

 you? But they have been IIM d to working for 

 nothing so long', that the little makes them think they 

 are doing very well. 



7065. One hears every now and then, not infrequent 

 ly, about the enormous" profits that farmers have been 

 making during the war. Do you think those profits 

 are anything like what they are represented to be 

 in some quarters? I know they are not. 



7086. You have had a very long experience, and that 

 is why I am putting these questions to you. Do you 

 think' that the profits made during the war by the 

 farming community will equal the losses sustained 

 by the farming community during the previous 35 

 years? No. 



7067. They really have not got their own back? 

 No. 



7068. With regard to transport, have you considered 

 the question generally, or only in relation to the 

 getting of milk to the market? Chiefly with regard 

 to milk ; but I think it applies generally. 



7069. Do you think a system of Light Railways or of 

 motor vans would be the I" st :- A little while ago, 

 I think it was the Board of Agriculture, made an 

 enquiry as to the laying down of Light Railways 

 by the side of the existing main roads. Another 

 suggestion was that ordinary light railways should 

 be laid with an independent line. The main road 

 idea would entail narrow gauge which would mean 

 twice trans-shipping the produce between the place 

 of loading and its destination. That would be waste- 

 ful. Do you think that is a system yon would a'dvo- 

 c*te? No, I do not think that would be a good 

 system. 



7070. Do you think light railways with the ordinary 

 gauge, so that the waggons could bo shifted from the. 

 line on to the main railway is preferable? Yes. The 

 main difficulty in the farmer getting his goods and 

 delivering his goods to the purchaser, is tho question 

 of trans-shipment, and that particularly applies to 

 smaller quantities of stuff. He not only suffers in 

 delay, but he suffers in very serious damage to his 

 goods. For instance, take the sending of cheese. He 

 does not know his own cheese when tln-v get to the 

 end of the railway journey by tho lime they have been 

 transshipped twice, which h.ippcns very frequently 

 now. 



7071. What I want to get is your opinion as to the 

 belt method of transport. As against the light rail- 

 ways there is the possibility, either under (!nvern 

 ment management or by some other means, of estab- 

 lishing a service of motor lorries or motor vehicles of 

 nme sort to travel along the existing nmd- 



tho damage that would lie done to the roads and tho 

 cost of repairs necessary, nhich. in your opinion 

 would be the better system, tho light railway system 

 or the motor lorry system ? For prnrt irid purpose* 

 the lorry system would be far preferable ; but it does 

 appear to me that there are serious dillic iilties in the 

 way of utilising tho present roads for lorry traffic, 

 because it does very serious dnmngo to the roads. Tn 

 order to make the roads w> tluit they would stand 

 the heavy lorry traffic, you would have to treat them 

 in such a way that they are almost useless, and are 

 Try dangerous for horo traffic : so it looks an though 

 you would have to selert certain roads, and sporinllv 

 construct them for motor traffic for this through 



. and reserve tho other roads for the sake of 



ili.' burses. At present accident* are happening frr 

 ,|ii. inly on the roads that are made specially suitable 

 for motor vehicles. 



707-'. It would mean a very heavy cost in bottoming 

 the roads? I do not think it is so much the bottom 

 ing as the surface. 



7073. Unless there is a bottom it would go through 

 any surface V it is a big undertaking uhiH 

 uay it is looked at. 



fn;i. My own opinion rather was, that in view of 

 the heavy cost and difficulties of the roads, a light 

 railway system might be better generally? I would 

 not like to express an opinion on that at the moment. 



7070. Mi .l'/<f>j/: You represent the Cheshire Milk 

 Producers' Association, which is chiefly concerned 

 with the dairy business? Yes. 



7076. And the Cheshire Chamber of Agriculture, 

 which is concerned with the general interests ot 

 farming industry? Yes. 



7077. In normal times the chief financial interest 

 of the average farmer in Cheshire was the dairy 

 business, was it not? Yes, and potatoes. There is 

 quite a fair -sized area in addition to that, where they 

 pursue arable farming and sell all the crops .off and 

 cart the manure back again. 



7078. Which part of Cheshire is that? That is 

 Altrijicham way. 



7079. North-west? Yes. 



7080. Then, except for a district in the north-west 

 of the county, the chief interest is in the live-stock 

 and dairying business? Yes. 



7081. That would have continued to have been the 

 chief interest during the war, would it not, had it not 

 been for the action of the Executive Commit toe :- I ' 

 you think that that is still when- the interests of the 

 Cheshire farmer lies? Yes, I think that that is so. 



7082. I have just been running through the statis- 

 tics with which no doubt you are acquainted; and 1 

 find, taking tho average of the county, in each 100 



there is roughly about CO acres of pasture and 

 about 40 acres of arable. Then on each 100 acres 

 there are only about 4 acres of wheat and about 11 

 acres of oats ; about 5 acres of potatoes, 15 acres of 

 clover, and 3 acres of roots, but there are 21 cows and 

 heifers on 100 acres. So that really you have no 

 barley, practically speaking, in the county? No, we 

 do not grow any barley. 



7083. So that what we have heard about the crops 

 which would be affected by a guarantee, applies to 

 about 15 acres of oats and wheat, which is quite a 

 small matter in the total business of th 



farmer of the county, is not u- Yes. 



7084. So that you are roally concerned chiefly with 

 the price of milk, of store stock, and of potatoes? 

 YOB, and cheese. 



7085. I mean milk products. Then so far as the 

 financial interests of the Cheshire farmer are oon- 

 n rued, who is one of the best farmers in the country 

 on the average, the guarantees do not affect him very 

 seriously? Not to the same extent as in some other 

 counties. 



7086. You recognise that behind the guarantees 

 are two principles, more or less; the principle of 

 MM-iiring a national food supply up to a point, and 

 tho principle of securing tho financial interests of 

 the arable farmer under the Corn Production Act? 

 V,- 



7087. Can you give any reason wh\ th* i a -HUTS. 

 a- business men, are so frequently concerned with 

 tho first principle, the cultivation for defence pur- 

 poses? I am sorry to break the Miles, but are those 

 statistics old statistics or n< 



7088. liil.V- The situation > :,l,h 

 rod now. 



7d-!>. In what proporlon:- The .'liable farming lias 

 increased very largely. Tho corn growing area has 

 increased very largely; but I do not know what the 

 figures are. They are very large. 



7090. But you stated just now that that was due 

 entirely to the action of the Executive Committee, 

 and not to any desire on tho part of the farmers to 

 cultivate cereals as a business proposition? Yes, it 

 was due largely to the action of the Kxeoutive Com- 

 mittee for national purposes. 



