276 



CONGRESS, UNITED STATES. 



Congress. The Senator from Michigan does 

 not exaggerate its magnitude. Sir, it is much 

 to be aSenator of the United States, with all 

 the powers and privileges pertaining to that 

 office powers and privileges legislative, diplo- 

 matic, and executive ; and the question now is 

 whether all these extraordinary powers and 

 privileges shall bo recognized in a gentleman 

 whose certificate has been sent to the Chair. 

 I thought it my duty, on hearing that certifi- 

 cate read as I entered the chamber, to move 

 at once its reference to the Committee on the 

 Judiciary. I am astonished that there can be 

 any hesitation in making that reference. Sir, 

 Senators who hesitate show an insensibility to 

 the character of the question. Is the Senate 

 ready to act blindfolded or with the eyes open ? 

 I insist that on a question of this magnitude 

 the Senate shall act with the eyes open, wide 

 open ; and I know no other way in which they 

 can be brought to act so except through the 

 intervention of a responsible committee of this 

 body. Therefore, sir, I proposed that the cre- 

 dentials should be referred to that committee. 

 It will be the duty of the committee, as my 

 friend from Michigan has suggested, to consider 

 in the first place whether a State in armed re- 

 bellion like Virginia can have Senators on this 

 floor. That is a great question, constitutional, 

 political, practical. It will be their duty, then, 

 to consider in the next place whether the gen- 

 tleman whose credentials have been presented 

 has been chosen legally under the Constitution 

 of the United States by any State. Now, sir, 

 I do not intend to prejudge either of these 

 questions. I simply open them now for the 

 consideration of the Senate." 



Mr. Saulsbnry : " I am glad, Mr. President, 

 that we are furnishing evidence every day that 

 we are a progressive people. We are learning 

 something. These points, however, have not 

 been presented to-day for the first time. I rec- 

 ollect that when my friend before me (Mr. 

 Willey) and my other friend who is now ab- 

 sent from his seat (Mr. Carlile) applied for ad- 

 mission to this body as Senators from the State 

 of Virginia, a few of us, a small corporal's 

 guard, objected (not on account of any per- 

 sonal dislike to those honorable members) to 

 their being admitted as members of this body, 

 because we contended then that the Legisla- 

 ture of the State of Virginia had not sent 

 those gentlemen here. We thought that the 

 State of Virginia- then was at war with the 

 Government of the United States, and we 

 thought that Senators professing to represent 

 a State should in fact represent the sovereignty 

 of that State. 



" So, sir, it is too late for any member of 

 this body to say that he opens these points 

 now. They were opened years ago, and to my 

 amazement, if I could be amazed at any thing 

 transpiring either here or elsewhere in the 

 country, I find some of those who were then 

 most zealous for admitting the honorable Sen- 

 ators who claimed to represent the State of 



Virginia here, now most vehement in their op- 

 position to the admission of the new Senator." 



Mr. Foster: "When I was up before I sim- 

 ply suggested that it did not appear to me that 

 the question in the case would be raised on a 

 simple reference of these credentials. I think 

 so now. No gentleman has suggested that on 

 these credentials any question but their duo 

 legal form arises, except the honorable Senator 

 from Illinois (Mr. Trumbull), who cites cases 

 that have been previously referred on creden- 

 tials and considered on credentials. He has 

 referred to the case of the State of Indiana. 



" Now, the honorable Senator from Massa- 

 chusetts (Mr. Sumner) speaks of this as a 

 mighty question, and he says that persons who 

 do not perceive that it is a mighty question are 

 insensible to its greatness. I agree with him 

 that it is a great question, and I certainly am 

 not to be charged with overrating it when I 

 suggest that the question is too mighty to be 

 ra'ised on the simple credentials. He speaks 

 of the credentials as a certificate to enable men 

 to sit here. By what else does the honorable 

 Senator sit here, except by what he calls a cer- 

 tificate ? He refers to the honorable Senator 

 from New York, and to the honorable Senator 

 from Pennsylvania. By what other tenure do 

 they hold their seats here except a certificate, 

 if the honorable Senator chooses to call it so ? 

 How does the certificate of either of those 

 Senators differ from this ? It has the seal of 

 the State sending the Senator, certified by cer- 

 tain officers. If this has the same, what is the 

 difference?" 



Mr. Sumner : " The Senator refers, for in- 

 stance, to myself as a Senator from Massachu- 

 setts. Suppose it was matter of public notori- 

 ety that I came into this chamber with a cer- 

 tificate from a body of men in Boston, little 

 more in number and character than the com- 

 mon council of that city, by public report not 

 in fact supposed to represent the State ; suppose 

 that that was a fact much received in the coun- 

 try ; then I submit to the Senator whether it 

 would not be the duty of the Senate before re- 

 ceiving my credentials to inquire into their 

 origin." 



Mr. Foster: "Certainly. I agree most de- 

 cidedly in the case put by the honorable Senator 

 that such would be the duty of the Senate ; but 

 if, in that state of facts, the honorable Senator 

 came here with credentials verified according 

 to the usual forms, signed by the Secretary of 

 State of the State of Massachusetts, with the 

 seal of that noble Commonwealth attached to 

 the instrument, certifying that the honorable 

 Senator had been duly elected a Senator in t lie 

 Congress of the^United States from such a date 

 to such a date, and that credential was in due 

 and proper form, I submit with great confidence 

 that on merely referring that document to the 

 Judiciary Committee no such question as the 

 honorable Senator suggests would be raised be- 

 fore that committee or before the Senate." 



Mr. Howard : " It seems to me the duty of 



