186 



CONGRESS. (THE DINGLEY BILL.) 



dollar transactions, as Mr. Alfred de Rothschild 

 said in the Berlin conference. He said : ' Why, we 

 can not have full legal-tender silver. My house 

 transacts business amounting to several million dol- 

 lars at a time, and we could not have silver dollars.' 

 Oh, no, that kind of money must not be made for 

 that race and that class of bankers." 



Mr. Hoar : " Perhaps that is very good sarcasm 

 on Baron Rothschild, if he be a baron, but it does 

 not quite answer my inquiry. I understand the 

 Senator to say that if we opened our mints to the 

 free coinage of silver there would be no temptation 

 whatever to bring the silver from any part of the 

 earth here ; that it would remain as now perform- 

 ing its functions. To be sure, there is a limited 

 coinage there, but it would remain just where it is 

 now. The limited coinage of silver in all those 

 countries is the equal of gold at a ratio, as the Sen- 

 ator has just stated. I can not understand, if that 

 proposition be true, how it is that the limitation 

 of the coinage of silver in those countries or in 

 this country makes any difference to any mortal 

 man." 



Mr. Cockrell : " It makes all the difference in the 

 world, as I have said." 



Mr. Hoar : " The silver in this country now, un- 

 der our limited coinage of silver, our $500,000,000 

 or $600,000,000, is equal to gold." 



Mr. Cockrell : " Oh, no." 



Mr. Hoar : It is quite as good." 



Mr. Cockrell : " Oh, no." 



Mr. Hoar : " Certainly. It is true that in the 

 panic several years ago silver was 3 per cent, above 

 gold in value." 



Mr. Cockrell : " Certainly it was, and Secretary 

 Carlisle refused to receive gold for it at that time.'' 



Mr. Hoar : " I understand. I am not talking 

 about the bullion values; I am talking about the 

 money values." 



Mr. Cockrell : " That is it exactly." 



Mr. Hoar: "The silver in this country which we 

 have coined is equal in money value to gold to-day. 

 It is equal in the other countries in money value to 

 gold, where it is coined, the limited amount, and 

 the silver of the world exists, that in money and 

 that in the arts, with that value. Now, I am not 

 asking about whether the fact be so or not, but I 

 take the Senator's statement. He says for us to 

 open our mints to silver would not change that." 



Mr. Cockrell : " It would not cause that silver to 

 come to our mints." 



Mr. Hoar: "It would not cause it to come to this 

 country. Therefore it would leave the silver of the 

 world exactly where it is unaffected. If that be 

 so, what earthly difference does it make whether 

 the existing condition shall continue or not ? " 



Mr. Cockrell: "There are two things. Silver is 

 a limited legal tender there, and in that capacity it 

 is not a measure of value." 



Mr. Hoar : " If the Senator will pardon me, the 

 coined silver is a full legal tender there as it is 

 here." 



Mr. Cockrell : " No ; I beg pardon. There are 

 two kinds of coined silver." 



Mr. Hoar: " It is of full legal value." 



Mr. Cockrell : " There is the limited legal tender, 

 $619,909,000. That is limited in legal tender, any- 

 where from $2 up to $10 40 shillings in England. 

 That does not pay any of the debts and obligations. 

 Silver is not the standard and measure of value. 

 The standard and measure of value in England is 

 gold. In Germany it is the gold standard. In 

 other nations it has been the gold standard. The 

 amount of gold is the measure of value of the prod- 

 ucts of the world, and silver is not estimated in it. 

 Therefore gold has doubled in its increased pur- 

 chasing power, and silver does not affect prices. 



Gold does affect prices, and its scarcity decreases 

 prices." 



Mr. Teller : " Will the Senator from Missouri al- 

 low me to suggest to the Senator from Massachu- 

 setts that the silver in this country would perform 

 exactly the same function if it was paper that it 

 does now ? " 



Mr. Hoar : " Undoubtedly." 



Mr. Cockrell : " Precisely. It is not treated as 

 money of final payment at all." 



Mr. Teller : " It would not measure value." 



Mr. Hoar: "That is transferring the question to 

 another thing. My question was to test the sound- 

 ness or correctness of the Senator's argument, which 

 has been so very interesting and so very powerful 

 and clear. I will state my proposition. It does 

 not make any difference whether the gold is the 

 standard or not with reference to this proposition. 

 The Senator says there is in Germany and in 

 France and in England a certain amount of silver. 

 Being a limited amount whether in terms it is a 

 legal tender in small sums or large in fact, the 

 coined silver of those countries is equal in its ex- 

 isting value not bullion value, but the value after 

 it is coined to gold." 



Mr. Gray : " In exchangeable value." 



Mr. Hoar : " In exchangeable value. You can at 

 any time take silver dollars or their equivalent in 

 this country, in England, or elsewhere, and ex- 

 change them for corresponding gold coin on equal 

 terms. So far that is agreed. The Senator says if 

 you were to open the mints of this country to the 

 unlimited coinage of silver, instead of limiting it to 

 the limited amount of circulation here, there would 

 not any more silver come to this country than there 

 is now ; that the same amount of silver would re- 

 main over there, because there is no temptation to 

 bring it here. Then the silver of the world would 

 be in exactly the same condition." 



Mr. Teller : " No ; not in the same condition." 



Mr. Hoar : " Abroad they would have it in the 

 same condition. The silver of the world would 

 maintain in those countries precisely the same rela- 

 tion to gold that it has now, and the silver here 

 would have the same relation to gold that it has 

 now." 



Mr. Cockrell : " Oh, no." 



Mr. Hoar: "Now, what earthly advantage is 

 there in those countries to the gold men, to these 

 Rothschild demons, in maintaining their limited 

 coinage, if taking away the limit does not change 

 the relation between coined silver and coined gold 

 and does not make a flow of the silver of the world 

 to one country, to the country where the coinage 

 is unlimited from the countries where it is limited ? 

 What earthly difference does it make ? That is my 

 proposition." 



Mr. Cockrell : " Mr. President, I have explained 

 fully that the silver money of the world where it is 

 will remain there and will not come if we restore 

 the free and unlimited coinage. It is limited in 

 its power there. There are $679,909,000 of limited 

 legal-tender silver. It is coined at the ratio of 

 about 14| to 1. There is much less silver in it, 

 from 5 to 10 cents less silver, and it will not come 

 here. The amount of the silver as full legal tender 

 there is limited. There is no free coinage. It is 

 limited in amount. It is the full equal of gold 

 there ; they are using it as such ; they will not part 

 with it ; they must have it in the character in which 

 it is used now, and they must add to it." 



Mr. Hoar : " Should we have any more silver 

 coined here than we have now?" 



Mr. Cockrell : " I think we should have more 

 coined here." 



Mr. Hoar : " Where would it come from ? " 



Mr. Cockrell : " I think perhaps not so much 



