CONGRESS, UNITED STATES. 



201 



There being no returns from the parishes of St. 

 Tammany and Terrebonne, and only meagre, in- 

 formal, and illegal returns from the parishes of Iber- 

 villc and St. James, we do not take tue responsibility 

 to declare the result of the election in the same, but 

 postpone action to await the determination of the 

 General Assembly. 



Mr. Thnrman : " How is the majority ac- 

 cording to the legal returns ? " 



Mr. Trnmbull: "On the Legislature?" 



Mr. Thnrman: "No; on the Governor." 



Mr. Trumbull : " The Legislature counts the 

 vote for Governor. The board make up a 

 statement of it, and then it goes to the Legis- 

 lature, which under the constitution is required 

 to declare the vote for Governor. The ma- 

 jority on the Governor's vote, I think, is about 

 seven thousand for McEnery; I have not the 

 figures before me." 



Mr. Thurman: " Is it seven thousand after 

 rejecting the returns of which the Senator 

 from Illinois on my right (Mr. Logan) has 

 spoken t " 



Mr. Morton: "Those returns are not re- 

 jected." 



Mr. Trumbull: "I will turn to the exact 

 figures. I can give them in a moment." 



Mr. Thurman : " Let us have them." 



Mr. Trumbull: "The vote for Governor, ac- 

 cording to the Mitchell board that was the 

 board that succeeded the De Feriet board is 

 66,403 for McEnery and 59,760 for Kellogg. 

 That is a majority of between six and seven 

 thousand. The Mitchell board succeeded the 

 De Feriet board; the Senator understands, I 

 suppose, how that is ? " 



Mr. Thurman: "Yes, sir." 



Mr. Trumbull: "The Mitchell board made 

 this computation of the votes for Governor, 

 and that is the result at which they arrived. 

 If the Senator from Ohio will turn to the last 

 page of this volume of testimony, he will find 

 what was said by Mr. Ray in regard to forged 

 returns : 



John Ray recalled. 



The WITXESS: I desire to call the attention of 

 the committee to A statement, at a suggestion made 

 by one member of the committee yesterday. I ex- 

 amined and found, and if the committee will act as 

 experts they will find, that the commissioners of 

 elections in several cases in the parishes have their 

 name* forged to the affidavits. For instance, there 

 it one from Madison parish (exhibiting the papers), 

 and so in the parish nf Grant also ; and in the parish 

 of 1'oint Coupeo, and in the parish of East Baton 

 Rouge, which if the committee will examine as ex- 

 perts they will find it very evident in some cases 

 that they were forged. 



" That was the evidence about it, the state- 

 ment of Mr. Ray. We had no other evidence 

 of their being forged at all, and I was never 

 satisfied myself that there were any forged 

 returns." 



Mr. Morton : " This whole matter arises 

 under the constitution and liiws of a State. 

 It is a State question. Whether Governor 

 Kellogg was elected is a question arising en- 

 tirely under the constitution nnd laws of 

 Louisiana, and as to who compose the Legis- 



lature of Louisiana is a question arising en- 

 tirely under the laws of that State, to be de- 

 termined by the Legislature itself; and now 

 the broad proposition is that Congress shall 

 come in and determine the question of an elec- 

 tion arising exclusively under the laws of a 

 State. I say it is not competent for it to do 

 it under any circumstances, that the question 

 of a fraud under State laws is to be determined 

 by the State tribunals. We must recognize 

 the authority of the State tribunal in a case of 

 that kind ; we must recognize the authority 

 of the Supreme Court of Louisiana; we must 

 recognize the authority of the returning board ; 

 we must recognize the authority of each House 

 of that Legislature to determine who were en- 

 titled to seats and who were not. That is a 

 right that belongs to every legislative body in 

 the world. They are the judges of the elec- 

 tions and qualifications of their own members. 

 We can determine whether a Senator was law- 

 fully elected to this body ; but we cannot go 

 into that Legislature and inquire whether A B 

 or C D received a majority of the votes at the 

 polls. That is a question first to be determined 

 in Louisiana by the returning board, mid next 

 by the House of which those persons were 

 members; and when they have settled that it 

 is not for us to go behind it. 



"There is not a question in this case that 

 does not arise under the constitution and laws 

 of Louisiana. They are all State questions, 

 and their State tribunals have settled them. 

 First, the returning board held by the Supreme 

 Court to be the lawful board determined who 

 were elected members of the Legislature, nnd 

 we are bound to give that credit. You may 

 say they decided wrongfully ; you may say 

 they acted without returns and all that; but, 

 sir, it is the tribunal created by the laws of 

 the State to settle that very question, and we 

 must give due credit to its finding. If we can 

 go behind the finding of that board nnd say 

 they acted upon false information or had not 

 the returns, we do it in every other State of 

 the Union. The next time when we are asked 

 to do it the case need not be quite so glaring ; 

 a smaller fraud will answer; and the third 

 time a still weaker case will answer, until the 

 Congress of the United States shall have the 

 organization of every State Legislature in its 

 hand. 



"Sir, we dare not adopt that doctrine. It 

 would result in the absorption and destruction 

 of the State governments. The States have a 

 right to organize their Legislatures in their 

 own way. That is a right reserved to them 

 under the Constitution. I do not believe in 

 State sovereignty, but I believe in State rights, 

 and the Constitution of the United States has 

 guaranteed to every State the right to organize 

 its Legislature in its own way, and to deter- 

 mine by its own tribunals whether it has a 

 lawful quorum, or whether its members are 

 entitled to seats, and when they have made 

 that determination we are bound by it. If we 



