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CONGRESS, UNITED STATES. 



indorsement, and the indorsement is as regular 

 upon the one as it is upon the other. It can 

 never be found out, then, which is the true re- 

 turn until you open them and see whether the 

 evidence of the title of these electors is con- 

 tained in the return, to wit : The certificate of 

 the Executive of the State, under the great seal 

 of the State, that they are the electors. There- 

 fors it is not for the President of the Senate to 

 decide this question in the first instance at all. 

 He must open the returns, all that come to him 

 in that way. If there are two from one State, 

 he must open them both ; if there are three, he 

 must open them all, for one may be a forgery 

 or two may be forgeries, and the third one may 

 be the lawful and the only lawful return. So, 

 then, you see that the question asked by the 

 Senator from Rhode Island in nowise tends to 

 prove that any judicial power over this subject 

 is vested in the President of the Senate. 



"Now, while in my judgment no vote that 

 is regular on its face and that has been given 

 by the true electors, that is to say no certificate 

 of these electors which is substantially correct, 

 ought to be rejected unless both Houses concur 

 in the validity of the objection to it, and there- 

 fore the main purpose of the substitute offered 

 by the Senator from Indiana is correct, yet the 

 substitute is defective for the reason I have al- 

 ready stated. It does not provide for a case in 

 which two returns may come from the same 

 State, as has been the case heretofore. Some 

 provision ought to be made for that case. It 

 ought to be provided that where that is the . 

 case the Houses shall decide between those re- 

 turns, and how they shall decide, and such a 

 provision as that requires great care in draught- 

 ing it. 



" But, sir, the defect that has been pointed 

 out is not the only defect of the twenty-second 

 joint rule. I appeal to the experience of every 

 Senator who has ever been at the count of a 

 presidential vote, and especially to every Sen- 

 ator who was present at the last count that 

 was made, and I ask him whether he did not 

 find himself embarrassed beyond measure by 

 the provision in this rule that there should be 

 no debate in either House ? The rule express- 

 ly provides that. It provides for deciding upon 

 the returns. It provides that the Senate is to 

 retire and decide for itself; the House of Repre- 

 sentatives is to decide for itself; they are to meet 

 together, and the result is to be announced, 

 and there shall be no debate in either House. 

 Now, I put it to the Senate the other day, and 

 I beg leave to remind Senators again of the 

 fact, that at the last count of the votes the 

 question of the reception of a return from Ar- 

 kansas depended upon the question whether 

 the certificate of the Governor that the persons 

 voting were the electors of that State was un- 

 der the great seal of the State or not. It was 

 said that it was not the great seal, but was the 

 seal of the Secretary of State alone, and one of 

 the Senators from that State at first thought 

 that the State had no other seal than that, but 



it turned out upon an examination that the 

 State had a great seal ; and yet no Senator was 

 allowed to rise in his place and state to the 

 Senate or to offer any resolution embodying 

 the statement of the fact that that State had a 

 great seal. The very question upon which the 

 reception of the returns depended was to be 

 decided without knowledge of the fact, and the 

 only knowledge that could be communicated 

 of it was by conversation with each other on 

 this floor before the vote was taken. That 

 ought not to be the case. 



"Therefore, while I favor the adoption of the 

 idea contained in the substitute, yet as I feel 

 that it is imperfect, that it ought to go further, 

 that further provisions are absolutely neces- 

 sary, and I have perfect confidence that the 

 Committee on Privileges and Elections can in 

 a short time frame a proper rule, and believe 

 that when it shall have framed it it will meet 

 with no serious opposition but can pass, and 

 pass both Houses at the present session, I move 

 to refer the resolution and substitute to the 

 Committee on Privileges and Elections." 



Mr. Morton : " I will take the case of two 

 returns from the same State. They come be- 

 fore the two Houses under the rule as we 

 now propose to amend it. We must presume 

 something in favor of the honesty and of the 

 integrity of the two Houses. I would rather 

 leave it to the two Houses to determine which 

 is the forged and the spurious return than to 

 leave it to one House. You cannot make any 

 specific rule for a case of that kind. Here 

 are two returns. The first is opened and read. 

 It is objected to. The Houses separate and 

 vote upon that question. They both agree that 

 it is forged, that it is spurious in some form. 

 The next one comes. That is the true one; 

 still an objection is made, and the two Houses 

 vote. You would not allow one House to re- 

 ject both returns because one House may do 

 it now. Take it as the rule now stands, one 

 House may reject both returns ; or, take it 

 as the rule now stands, one House may reject 

 one return and the other House may reject the 

 other return, and so the State gets no vote at all. 

 Is it not safer, if this matter is to be referred to 

 Congress at all, that it shall be made to depend, 

 like a law, upon the concurrent vote of both 

 Houses, instead of leaving it to one House, with- 

 out debate, without consideration, and without 

 adjournment, to reject the vote of Massachu- 

 setts, or New York, or in fact of all the States? 



" Mr. President, see what a fearful tempta- 

 tion is presented to throw the election into the 

 House of Representatives. I will not presume 

 there is any purpose of that kind or that any 

 House would do it, but I ask you to notice the 

 fearful temptation. At the very next election 

 the House will be Democratic and the Senate 

 will be Republican. An objection is made to 

 the vote of a State ; the two Houses separate 

 and vote upon it. The vote of that State may 

 elect a Republican candidate for President. By 

 rejecting the vote of that State the election 



