MINUTES OF EVIDENCE. 



37 



16 September, 1919.] 



PROFESSOR R. G-. WHITE. 



[Continued. 



merely fixing prices at anything at all within the 

 range of practical politics would not prevent a very 

 large proportion of the land in North Wales going 

 back to grass. 



10.045. That is what I want to get at. Does not 

 that depend on the amount of the guaranteed prices 

 that are fixed? Yes; but I mean anything within 

 reason. 



10.046. My experience of the farmer is that he will 

 grow the crops that will pay him best? I will put it 

 in this way : Supposing that on a certain farm a 

 faririer is going to make 600 a year clear profit, by 

 having say half the land under the plough, and on 

 the same farm almost entirely under grass he is sure 

 of a profit of 400, he will let the land go to grass. 



10.047. Although he could make 200 a year more? 

 Yes, at the present time. 



10.048. Are you a Welshman? No, I am what is 

 worse possibly a Yorkshireman. 



10.049. Do not say that; I am also. Do you really 

 mean that because I cannot credit it? I do, 

 honestly. 



10.050. You do not mean to say the Welshman is 

 an idle man? It is not a question of idleness; it is a 

 question of the trouble of facing the labour question 

 at the present time. As someone said, farming is not 

 merely a means of making money, but it is a mode 

 of life; and so long as the fanner is sure of a com- 

 fortable living, a very great number of them, at any 

 rate would be content with a less annual income, 

 provided they were going to be clear of trouble. 



10.051. We are here to consider agriculture, and 

 we do not want to keep idle people on the land. We 

 want the land to produce as much as it can; yet you 

 tell me, if it is made too profitable the tenant farmer 

 would prefer the easier way and let it go back to 

 L;P;ISS? You can see what happens at the present 

 time. 



10.052. I suggest the reason for that is because it 

 is not profitable? I think the accounts I have sub- 

 mitted to you from a typical farm show that, at any 

 rate, it is fairly profitable. 



10.053. I do not want to go back on that ; but take 

 your accounts, all the way through. If your tenant 

 had to borrow his money and pay interest on it, he 

 could hardly have lived, could he? Not taking the 

 period as a whole. 



10.054. Mr. Batchdor: On your balance sheet for 

 1911 in the capital account I perceive the overdraft 

 interest for the year is entered. Should not that have 

 been against the working account of the year instead 

 of against the capital account? That arrangement of 

 the account is put in at the request of our auditors, 

 and it is not for me to question it. If you reckon it 

 up in the eight years that I have shown here, it is 

 a very small item and hardly affects the general 

 position. 



10.055. My reason for asking is, that the moment 

 you get the loan paid off, you give credit in the work- 

 ing account for the bank interest 21 Is. 6d. By 

 that time, you see, you have paid off all your debt ? 

 That has struck me from time to time; but again I 

 do not wish to put my opinion against that of our 

 auditors. There is also this : In the last year you 

 will notice we wiped off the whole of the deficit due 

 to bank interest. 



10.056. I notice that. Against the year 1918 you 

 have put all your overdraft interest of previous years, 

 instead of letting each year stand by itself? Yes. 



10.057. Coming back to the balance sheet for 1911, 

 there is " Law costs, lease of College Farm and land 

 for cottages, 80 15s. Od." Is that just for a leasi-!' 

 It is the whole of the costs in connection with the 

 taking of the farm the law costs. 



10.058. Does it cost 80 15s. Od. to take a farm at 

 427 a year rent? It certainly did to draw up this 

 lease. It wa\ an exorbitant charge, I admit. 



10.0.".!). I (1<, not know about exorbitant, but it is 

 very high. You have a credit entry in each of the 



26831 



working accounts for farm fees. What is that for? 

 A proportion of the fees payable by a certain class of 

 students who spent most of their time at the farm, 

 was charged to that ; and in the working account that 

 I have summarised, credit ought to have been given 

 for it, but it was so small that I did not think it 

 necessary to go into such detail. 



10.060. In the 1912 account I notice you have rates 

 and taxes, 64 11s. 6d. ? Yes. 



10.061. The previous year they were 34 Is. Od. 

 Have you any reason to almost double them? I am 

 sorry I cannot exactly answer that question. I was 

 not in charge of the farm at the time. I see they 

 have gone back. But I think probably the explana- 

 tion is that part of rates due for the year 1911 were 

 not paid until 1912, and there is really part of two 

 years included in 1912. I can only give that as a 

 probable explanation. 



10.062. I notice your costs of insurance vary con- 

 siderably. In 1911 they are 70 2s. 6d., and in 1912 

 they are 61 15s. 3d. Then 1913 is practically the 

 same; but when you come to 1914, your insurances 

 are down to 36 17s. 4d., and they are given in 

 detail? I think probably the explanation of that is 

 a difference in policy between my predecessor and 

 myself. He insured a lot of farm animals, valuable 

 horses, and that sort of thing. Personally, I came 

 to the conclusion that the rate of premium was so 

 high that it was not worth bothering about, and as 

 those lapsed, I did not renew them. I think that 

 is the chief reason. 



10.063. If you compare 1916 with the 1917 Fire 

 Insurance on buildings, cottages, etc., it is 6 12s 3d 

 in 1916, and 30 13s. 6d. in 1917? The explanation 

 of that is the same, I think. You will see it is pretty 

 much the same in 1918. 



10.064. I was wondering if it includes crops, 

 because I do not see crops mentioned in 1917 and 

 19 18 P Yes, I think that is probably the case. We 

 certainly increased all the insurance during 1916 or 

 during 1917, to allow for the rise in values, but I 

 think there is some overlapping there. The amounts 

 are not strictly comparable. 



10.065. Could you tell me on what principle you 

 arrived at the unexhausted value of manures and 

 feeding stuffs? We, or the valuer rather, follow in 

 that way the custom of the district, which is to allow 

 one third of the cost of feeding stuffs for the year 

 following their use, and one sixth for the year follow- 

 ing that. The practice with regard to valuing man- 

 ures varies a good deal. Nothing is allowed for 

 sulphate of ammonia and nitrate of soda; but I think 

 in the case of superphosphates and basic slag about 

 one half is allowed. 



10.066. Do you consider your land is as good as it 

 was before the war, or have you taken more out of it? 

 We have certainly taken more out of it, in this way, 

 that a considerable proportion was under grass, and 

 grass always represents an accumulation of fertility. 

 We have drawn on that to a great extent.. 



10.067. So may I take it in this way, that your un- 

 oxhaiisted values in the land are not now of so much 

 value as they were in previous years? No, I do not 

 think they are, though, at the same time, the con- 

 dition of the farm is no worse than in 1910 

 when the farm was taken over. It is not in the same 

 condition as it was in 1914. I think there is no 

 doubt of that; but as far as we can see, it is in about 

 the same condition as in 1910. 



10.068. Taking your account for tBe year ending 

 12th November, 1918, you had a very good year; be- 

 cause, in addition to the 483 7s. 7d. balance, you 

 wrote off the whole of the balance of the capital 

 account of 485 10s. 4d., and also 1,159 7s. 5d., 

 repayment of loan? Yes, though I think the position 

 is put rather more clearly in the summary that has 

 been circulated. The total would be just over 2,000, 

 really. 



10.069. That is for the year 1918. You made just 

 over 2,000 ; for the year finishing 1917, you made 

 fully 1, (XX)? Though that should be taken along 

 with the explanation that I have added, to a large 

 extent in these years we were reaping the benefit of 



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