M 



Koy.U. COM \USMi >X ON AGRICULTURE. 



11S.] 



SIR HENRY RBW, K.O.B. 





Because, after all, the only thing that matter*, or it 

 of value, is, what are the cost* of product inn by an 

 efficient farmer conducting his basinets for a profit. 



491. The question has been put to you as to whether 

 it would not be advisable to extend the area of 

 growing potatoes. Is it not a fact that very much of 

 the land in England is not at nil suitable to the 

 growth of that crop? -I should say so, although that 

 is a practical question on which 1 do not profess to 

 be an authority. But. so far as extending the area 

 of potatoes is concerned, we are growing at the present 

 time, with anything like an average crop, more pota- 

 toes than we can eat. 



493. If a guarantee is given to the farmer, how do 

 the Board propose to prevent the advantage of high 

 prices getting wholly into the pockets of the land- 

 lords by increased rente? You say how do the Board 

 propose? 



493. Tes? I ain not here to speak of the general 

 policy of the Board; and those questions, if they are 

 proper questions, should be addressed to the Secretary 

 of the Board, and I am afraid I cannot answer that. 



494. It is within your knowledge that land rented 

 at, say, a pound an acre, or so, has been recently 

 sold at prices of 50 or 60 an acre? Yes; I know 

 generally that is very likely true. 



495. I frankly admit that fanners have done 

 tolerably well during the war. You would agree with 

 rue that where landlords have sold their land, they 

 have had 11 greater advantage, without contributing 

 by labour upon the land or improving it, in the 

 high prices than the farmers have had. and have 

 made more profit in consequence where they have 

 sold their land? Yes; I dare say that is so, in some 

 cases at any rate. 



496. Mr. Prosper Jones : I should like to have your 

 opinion as to whether farmers who farm grass lands 

 are more secure from any depression that may come 

 in future than farmers who till the land? Under the 

 conditions existing before the war, certainly. 



497. Mr. T. Henderson, ll.-i- \oiir Department 

 made any attempt to correlate agricultural prices and 

 wages;' I do not know that we have made any 

 systematic attempt to do so. 



498. Has any attempt at all been made? I am not 

 quite sure what you moan ; because amongst other 

 things, that seems to me to be what this Commission 

 has to do. 



499. Yes ; but has any attempt been made to set up 

 a sliding scale? No. 



500. Any estimate at all? No. 



501. You expressed the opinion, I think, that, 

 broadly speaking, intensive cultivation employs more 

 men? Yes. 



502. Does that imply growing the same crops as 

 before the method of cultivation was changed? I am 

 not sure I follow the question. 



503. Ordinarily speaking, intensive cultivation 

 would monn employing more machinery; and I have 

 difficulty in understanding how more men could be 

 employed, if improved methods of cultivation meant 

 -lib-it it ut inn machinery for men- When I wan talk- 

 ing of intensive cultuation, 1 wa thinking of vejje 

 table i to|.s and crops of that description rutlu-i than 



and 1 said that, broadly speaking, crops of that 



-I it ion and the cultivation of land for crops of 



that description, would involve the employment of 



labour. It is true, of course, that "intensive 



farming in another sense would probably mean a 



greater employment of agricultural machinery ; but 



T do not think there is much evidence to show that 



the greatest use of machinery per acre or per 



thousand acres, in itself moans less manual labour per 



acre. 



504. But it is quite possible, I suppose, that \<m 

 might increase your food supply without increasing 

 your man supply? Quite. 



506. Improvements in cultivation might not lead to 

 rural re-population in this country? Certainly. 



.MMi. I prc-umi- that the results of the farming of 

 Hie Hoard will be placed before thin Commission? 

 They are quite at their disposal. T am sure. 



VI". Wi ./ M II mill i ini, \ ... MI your prei-i- 

 tbat the main statistics are the annual return of 



acreage, Ac., an annual return of produce, and so 

 forth. As I take it, there is nothing in any of these 

 which will help the Commission to the immediate 

 object they have in \ lew? That is rather a n 

 of opinion. 



608. What do you suppose is the object of our Com- 



I want to get at that, bco.au.-* e are 

 wandering a good deal, it seems to me? I am not 

 quite sure that I am a competent witness on tin 

 point. 



609. What really do the Board of Agriculture hope 

 or believe that this Commission will report, for or 

 against the minimum, or se forth? What is the real 

 gist of what we are after? I am afraid I must leave 

 that to the Commission (<> decide for them 

 They have their reference from the (iovermncnt . 



510. You say a Costings Committee ha 



up. Can you tell me what that Costings (oinin tt<r 

 amounts to in numbers? I am afraid I cannot off- 

 hand. Do you mean the office staff? 



511. I mean the staff of accountants that you mean 

 to set loose, or have set loose'on the country, to find 

 out the facts. 



Chairman: We have a witness from the Costings 

 Committee who will be able to answer those questions 

 hotter than Sir Henry. 



Mr. J. M. Henderson : He might answer them w ith 

 greater prepossession; I would rather get the view 

 of Sir Henry. 



512. How far has this Costings Committee staiinl 

 or effected any investigations on any farms through 

 out the country? I dp not think they have actually 

 started the investigation of any particular farm as 

 yet. They are just now engaged in laying out the 

 scheme of inquiry. 



513. How long have they been established? I 

 should say off-hand two or three months, or perhaps 

 :i little more, 



514. And they are still at the scheme. However, 

 it comes to this: that this Costings Committee have 

 submitted nothing to you, and have no data which 

 would help this Commission to get .it what they are 

 after? The Costings Committee so far have not fur- 

 nished the Board with any facts Itccaust', as I say, 

 they are not yet in the position to furnish them ; but. 

 the Director of the Costings Committee is, I believe, 

 coming before the Commission, and he would answer 

 those questions more authoritively than 1 can because 

 I am only speaking from memory. 



515. At all events you have no result of the cost 

 of working any farm, large or small, or the revenue 

 from the produce of the farm, which you can .submit 

 to the Commission as reliable, on which they could 

 base their Report P The only definite information of 

 that nature at all to which I can refer the Com- 

 mission, i.s that contained in the Report of the Wages 

 Board Committee on Farming Costs. 



516. How long do you expect it will be before you 

 get any data? -I really do not know; because it en- 

 tirely depends, of course, on how far it will be 

 possible to get accounts which have already been kept 

 by farmers in a form in which the Costings Committee 

 would like to have them. It is quite obvious that if 

 the Costings Committee do commence to collect in- 

 formation as to current operations as from, we will 

 say, three months ago, any figures at the eml ef three 

 months would not be of much value to your Com- 

 mission. 



617. Sir Daniel Hall, who was examined yesterday, 

 said that the Corn Production Art was to provide a 

 guarantee to the farmer to keep the average price up 

 to a certain figure. T put it to you in this way. 

 Supposing next year the minimum price is 70s. a 

 quarter, and suppose the world price is 60s. a quartei . 

 the farmer has to sell his wheat at 60s. a quarter, 

 and ho then comes down on the guarantee for 10s. a 

 quarter. Would that be so? Yes. 



518. Reverse the operation. In the year after that 

 he sells it at 80s. a quarter. He does not come upon 

 you for anything, but does he repay you anything?-- 

 No. 



619. So it is heads he wins and tails you lose? 

 The giving of the guarantee may or may not bo a 

 wise proceeding, but obviously that is the effect of a 

 guarantee. 



