... 



HOYAL lOMM N AGRICULTURE. 



Atiytul, I'.M 1 .'., 



MR. H. (J. HOWEI.I., F.C.A. 



[Continued. 



Mr. 1'arker: I am seeking to lind out what Mi 

 Hawaii's view* are as to codings owing to cvrtain 

 difficulties 1 Bee, but I will drop that. 



II ifw: If 1 might intervene, 1 think tho infor- 

 mation is bound to be of HCIAKC in various way.-, 

 when it is compiled, even although one may admit 

 one would have to wait w>im> time i..-i..ro its full 

 value could be shown up. You would have m 

 information with regard to, say, prices or wages, or 

 tho whole subject one may term as the general 

 economics of the industry, that is to say, the most 

 efficient sire or type of farm and the most ellicieiit 

 capitalisation of that farm or its equipment as regards 

 machinery and the number of labour, and as regards 

 also the respective shares of remuneration that should 

 go to the three great classes who arc interested, the 

 labourer, the farmer, and the landlord, if we may 

 roughly divide them in that way. In those and 

 other general economical bearings this information 

 cannot fail but to be of distinct service, I should 



1171. Chairman: But you are responsible only x>i 

 the giving of information? Our work ends at the 

 getting of the information. 



Chairman: That is all .that you can possibly 

 answer: as to how you get at the information, and 

 not what use is to be made of it when it is got. Those. 

 are the only questions which it seems to me are 

 material to be asked of the witness. 



1175. Mr. Parker: You say in your pr6ci* in the 

 note: "By financial accounts is meant the usual 

 account* of income and expenditure which issue in a 

 yearly profit and loss account and balance sheet, 

 showing the total profit or loss." In arriving at 

 the total profit and loss the valuation is made. 

 Should that valuation be made at the cost price and 

 kept more or less constant with the guarantee, or 

 should tho value bo written up to the market price of 

 the day? No; I think the valuation should be taken 

 on a cost basis where possible. 



1170. And kept as constant as possible? Yes. If 

 it were kept on a cost basis, it might fluctuate accord- 

 ing as the cost went up and down. You see what f 

 mean. 



1177. Tho farmer's balance sheet of the last year 

 would show a largo profit, but a groat deal of the 

 profit would be shown because tho value has been 

 written up? Yes. 



117". Would you consider that real profit? No, it 

 is not real profit in my view. 



117U. Mr. Xiclutlls: Has your Committee any com- 

 pulsory powers to require information from, farm- 

 ers? No; it is quite voluntary. 



1180. Have you got offers of assistance from the 

 farmers in the matter? Yes, a very large number 

 hare offered us assistance. 



1181. Supposing your officials in a certain year con- 

 sidered it would he useful to your Committee to get 

 information with regard to a certain farm or sot of 

 farms and they worn not willing to give it, you have 

 no power really to step in to get costs under those 

 conditions? No. 



1182. What I am thinking about is, that you would 

 get the evidence from a good type of farmer, but it 

 would bo useful sometimes to get information from 

 tho other type, and there are no means by which yon 

 cn got it 'if they refuse? No, we have not compul- 

 sory powers; but'so far as wo can, we shall endeavour 

 to get in touch with all typee of farmers, and no; 

 only the moro prosperous ones. We are fully ah\. 

 to 'thi' ii'-ed of making the information as represen- 

 tative as it is possible to be. 



11R3. What evidence you get is kept secret. They 

 know that? It u. 



11-1. I moan it is not used for any particular pur- 

 pOBeP No. Whatever purpose it in used for, it will 

 be quit* anonymous. We denote a farm by a letter 

 or number, or' some thing of that kind. 



11 So. And when you get the inclination, wlunis it 

 YOU ro|x.rt the information to which you get? We 

 re i'ij>poM>d to make a periodical report to V>e 

 Minister of Agriculture. 



1186. Any other department? No. 



1187. Mr. Lennard: In answer to Mr. Walker, you 

 hikid that the full information with regard to the 

 accounts you were collecting would not U< available 

 until IlkhMlBM year? I said as n : :"" 

 I arm product*, they will not br. 



1188. Yes, I think it was with regard to cereals 

 In tho course of your negotiations with farmers, 

 have you l*-n al.lo to obtain any information from 

 accounts tliev ha\e lieen in the hal.it of keeping 

 which would '^ivc us data in regard to last year or 

 this year? I am now in process of asking a certain 

 number of farmers we are in torn h with lor that 

 particular information for the purposes of this Com- 

 mission. 



1189. How' soon do you think wo might expect to 

 have that body of evidence!- I nm speaking now of 

 the request which was made by th. 



hist week to the t ostiniis ( ..iiimittee to get togelh. i 

 what information they could. That I will do my 

 best to get together in, say, three weeks. 



1190. Apart from actual accounts, would the infor- 

 mation possessed by the Costings Committee make 

 it possible to construct ideal balance sheets of farme 

 of the most economical size? When a sufficient 

 amount of information has been put together, yea. 



1191. Within the next few weeks, or only when the 

 re-nits of next year's inquiries are available?-- -1 would 

 like to be a little moro clear as to what you mean 

 by an ideal balance sheet. 



1192. I mean taking not the accounts of any 

 particular farm, but taking such information as you 

 ha\e evidence of, of the oust of labour, the cost of fer- 

 tilizers, and all the other requirements of the farmer. 

 and then considering how that would plan out for a 

 farm of a given size and a given quality of land? 

 Ws ; 1 think to a certain extent that will be able to ! 

 done by the information I am now endeavouring lo 

 get together. 



llii.'l. Mr. Langfonl : Mr. Lennard has asked jou 

 about an ideal balance sheet. I take it one of the 

 objects of your Committee would be to ascertain the 

 cost of growing particular crops in the various 

 YOB. 



1194. And by eo doing it may be found that in 

 some particular district a farmer is trying to grow 

 a crop which to him can nover be a profitable crop? 



1195. And in that case, 1 tako it, your Com- 

 mittee would advise, him to grow something which 

 was more profitable to him? Yes. 



1196. Is it your opinion that some farmers in 

 various parts of England arc perpetually trying to 

 grow crops which their land is not suitable for? Yes, 

 I think that is quite probable. 



1197. I would like to ask you this question: Is your 

 Committee responsible for taking costs throughout 

 the United Kingdom or does it merely apply to 

 England? Ye; our Committee is supposed to cover 

 the whole of the United Kingdom, owing to the 

 necessity of tho information being compiled on uni- 

 form lines and presented in a common way. 



1198. The question has already hecn asked yon n* 

 to whether you have compulsory powers; but whilst 

 you have not Mnpulsorv powers, yon lx-licvo that the. 

 farmers, gem-rally speaking, will co-operate with you 

 with regard to re-ndering every assistance for costs to 



iken on their particular funnel I can only 

 judge from the evidence we have alreadv. which if 



lilo; and by that I think they will co- 

 operate. 



119!'. I ; i oin your /i;<Yi.i that you ha\c already- 

 had a conference with no less than 22 farmers' 

 organisations?- -Yes. 



1200. Have you found in conference that they nave 

 willing or otherwise to render assistance? 



Ignite Milling in every way so Tar. 



1201. As a matter of Ret, the basis of levying In 

 Tax is compelling farmers to have recourse to 



keeping accounts? Yes, that is so. 



