MINUTES OF EVIDENCE. 



lit .\ngmt, 1919.] 



MR. W. T. LAWRENCE. 



[Continued. 



^. \ou are the Mr. I^yrence who is quoted in 

 one or two books on dairying, are you not-* I dare- 

 *y. . 



2239. Do you take away your calves at once? Yes. 



2290. You do not leave them with the cows 3 days:" 

 ---No, not at all. 



2291. And you do not have much milk fever? No; 

 we have only had one case of milk- fever in 27 years. 



2292. Mr. J. M. Henderson: You have given your 

 profit as 500, the general profit? Yes, that was last 

 year 



2293. You spoke of horses. Do you make any profit 

 on horses? Yes, a considerable amount. 



2294. Can you tell us what amount you did make 

 last year? I cannot straight off; because you see they 

 are not young horses we have bought and reared and 

 sold, but they are horses that we have bred, and I 

 cannot tell you ollhand now what it has cost us to 

 rear them. 



2295. You breed horses? Yes. 



2290. How many did you breed last year? Two 

 foals last year ; then we had two foals the year before. 



2l'9r. Do you do anything in the way of cattle 

 feeding and cattle selling? Yes. If we do not keep 

 strong bullocks on and if we sell them as young stores 

 12 months old about, we generally buy 8 for winter 

 feeding. We did not last year, as we were afraid we 

 should run short of food. 



2298. That was a good deal because of. the Irish 

 position, was it not? No, because we were rather 

 short of hay and roots. 



2299. Were not the Irish cattle largely sold to the 

 Army? Yes; but we do not buy Irish cattle for 

 feeding. We buy Shorthorn bullocks. 



2300. You do not rear your own calves, but sell 

 them? Just now as we have been going in for cheese 

 making so largely at the instance of the Board of 

 Agriculture, we have been selling all our bullock 

 calves, but we keep all our heifers. 



2301. Do you do a large business in butter? Yes. 



2302. And eggs ? Yes. 



2303. You are also a school? Yes. 



2304. Does the fact that you are a school tend to 

 increase your profit? No, it detracts from it, and 

 it makes it impossible to differentiate in many cases 



!i the actual charges which should go to the 

 farm and those which should go to the school. 



2305. You would not put yourself down as any 

 criterion for an ordinary farmer who had not a school 

 attached to his farm? No, not quite. We try to 

 keep a distinction as much as we possibly can, but it 

 is not always possible. 



230C. Could you supply us with a balance sheet for 

 the whole of your business?- I can supply you with 

 our last year's report which will contain it." 



2307. What we are on the hunt for is a balance 

 lhet which will show what your revenue was and 

 what your expenditure was in all its details, and fi 

 cannot be a very elaborate thing. I do not want to 

 trouble you about percentages, but I want the actual 

 figures? That is published in our annual report. 



2308. A balance shee-t? Yes. There would be no 

 difficulty in sending you copies of that. The one 

 ending for the year 31st March last is just out. 



2.309. Would you be so kind as to do that? Yes. 

 The only thing is this, that the farm and the school 

 are not actually divided there, bu* the items arc all 

 given s-'-paratelv and yon could ]>ick them out. 



2309.*. Then it does pay you to make choese? Yes. 

 we make some tons of cheese. 



2309n. It takes two gallons of milk to make a pound 

 of cheese, does not it? One gallon. 



3310. 3/r. ThoiiKix Henderson: You said in reply to 

 Mr. .1. M. Henderson that the commercial aspect of 

 your farm was rather a secondary object. I take it 

 yon are really a school? Yes. 



2311. So that you do not run it on entirely com- 

 mercial lines? Xo. 



2.312. So that the figure to which Mr. Batchelor 

 referred of CO.") gallons is not the actual figure for last 

 vear? \<i, not for last year. 



2313. But it is based upon your experience of pre- 

 vious years? -Yes. 



2311. Are there any dairy farms in the neighbour- 

 hood of your rh"f.l? Yes. 



2215-17. Does their milk yield show as big a produc- 

 tion as yours? I should think quite. With those 

 nho deal in milk selling I should think it is higher 

 because they are always buying the newly calved 

 cows, heavy milking cows, That is how it is they 

 sometimes get nipped in the matter of being under 3 

 per cent, of butter fat, because they have nearly 

 always flushed cows in. 



2318. Mr. Prosser Jones : You have told us you 

 have one man and two women working on this farm ? 

 No, we have three regular men working on the 

 farm. One of them is the cowman as put down here ; 

 then there are two women, one of whom is the cow- 

 man's wife, and the other is a woman who works in 

 the house, and they help with the milking. 



2319. Do you find these people becoming less effi- 

 cient than they were, say, in 1913-14? I do not know 

 that there is much difference, because these are not 

 young women. These are women who learned in their 

 childhood ; and it would come in at that time, I should 

 think. 



2320. You give the hours as 45 per week. Is that 

 an average for your district, or is it an exception in 

 your case? That is only referring to the allocation 

 of time of the cowman to the actual cows that are 

 milking. He works more than that; but then that 

 other time is devoted to the younger stock. It would 

 have been unfair to have put inhis full wages against 

 the cows and the milk yield, because a good deal 

 of that time would not have been devoted to the cows 

 at all ; he would have been engaged with his other 

 work. 



2321. You are able to produce milk in the summer 

 months at about Is. Id. a gallon, are you not? It 

 works out really at rather less than that on my 

 figures. 



2322. Yes; but after taking away the 32 as Mr. 

 Batchelor pointed out, it. is reduced considerably? 

 Yes; but as I said before, that does not apply to' this 

 year. It is by no means the price this year, because 

 we are cutting green corn to feed our cows on. 



2323. Could you tell us what it costs the consumer? 

 Is it about Is. a gallon? I think it was fixed at 

 Penrith during the summer time at about Is. 8d. or 

 Is. 6d. a gallon. I do not know really, but I think it 

 was 4Jd. or /5d. a quart in the summer. 



. -l/i. Lcnnurd: From your knowledge of milk- 

 producing farms of an average sort, do you consider 

 there is much room for improvement in the milking 

 qualities of the average herd? I think so; iand wo 

 are moving rapidly in that direction at the present 

 time, because the two milk-recording societies are 

 rapidly extending. Another thing is, that we have 

 just formed a dual-purpose shorthorn herd book in 

 which the registration will be based on milk yields, 

 and that in future, must have a very important effect 

 on the milk yield. It is a thing wo are paying a 

 good deal of attention to in the North. 



2325. An improvement could be obtained by ener- 

 getic effort in a few years? I think so. 



2326. And any improvement in milking qualify 

 would. I suppose, reduce the labour costs of a gallon 

 of milk, would it not? Yes; there ought not to be 

 any more labour, or not much more labour at anv 

 rate. 



2327. Do you think there is more room for this 

 improvement in the South of England than in the 

 North ?--! do not know. I cannot speak for the South 

 of England, of course. If yon increase the same 

 stamp of oow, although your labour would not increase 

 your feeding would. 



2328. Do you think there is more room on small 

 farms than on large? 



Chairman : The evidence of the Witness as to 

 whether it is a small farm or a big one, or the North 

 or South of England, would be useless if given. 



2329. Mr. Lennard: I suppose you would agree it 

 is practically impossible to improve the milking 

 quality of a herd if no milk records are kept? I 

 would not say that. 



2330. It would be very difficult? Yes. 



2331. Is it within your knowledge that the majoritv 

 of milk-producing farmers do not keep milk records? 

 Yes. 



2332. Have you any experience of milking ' 

 machines? Not at our own farm; but I am familiar 



