10,, 



1MVAI. 



>N u.iuri-i.rTKK. 



13 



, KM.'. 



Sin WILLIAM U. UKVKKIIHIK, K.I r. 



\C<mli>iud. 



would and what would not be a fair price P Certainly. 

 I think we did everything I will not nay we did 

 but we tried to do everything that was possible having 

 regard to the fact that we had to fix a certain price 

 by a certain time. 



9603. Going back ait far as May, 1917, a Commiti.- 

 wa Appointed with Lord Somcrleyton as Chairman 

 to go very ckwoly into the question of milk priced r 



Yes. 



2594. It was on tho advice of tii.u i ommitt-c, nhu h 

 sat for a very considerable time, that the lirst milk 

 prices were fixed P Yes. 



3605. Since the formation of the Agricultural 

 Advisory Council and the Consumers' Council, both 

 of those bodies have had questions of priced subnim- <1 

 to sub-committees of each of them who have met and 

 argued the point* out between them:- 'i .- 



2596. Taking it generally, it has been fairly 

 to arrive at a more or less unanimous decision u|x>n 

 the points that have been submitted to those sub- 

 committees? I should not have thought that wa.- 

 quite true; it certainly does not apply to nil articles. 



3597. It applies to meat? It appfies to meat for 

 nome reason; I do not know why. 



3598. The only serious difference of opinion was 

 with regard to the last winter supply of milk, vhere 

 tliu producer demanded '2s. 6d., 1 think it was, and 

 tho Consumers' Council 2s., and they decided on 

 2s. 3d. P Yes. 



2599. That was after very strict investigation. The 

 point was carefully thought out by the officials before 

 tho Food Controller came to a final decision? Yes. 



2600. With regard to cereals, before the Cabinet 

 came to a decision thoy took evidence, did they not, 

 from Mr. Strutt as representing the Board of Agri- 

 culture and myself as representing tho Ministry of 

 Food? That is more within your recollection than 

 mine. I hove no doubt that is true. 



3601. I only wanted to get the fact out. It was 

 eoP V 



2602. With tho evidence they had from i-e and 

 from others they ultimately decided what the price 

 of cereals should be? Yes. 



2603. That was based, so far as we could obtain it, 

 upon tho estimated cost of production? Yes. 



2604. It followed, did it not, that maximum prices. 

 so long as supply was below demand, resulted in their 

 becoming minimum prices too?- 



That must always be so where there is 

 e\,-n a comparatively short supply I moan to say, 

 a comparatively small difference between tho real 

 requirements and the actual supply?- Yi -. 



2606. The first control of cereals was the result of 

 ;i very rapidly rising market in wheat!- I have not 



i:it particular tiling in mind, but 1 have no 

 <|(iiilit that is eo. 



2607. .May I remind yon that in May. 11'17. wheat 

 rose as high as 90s.? "Yes. I remember now. 



-.It was because of that that tho then Food 

 Controller, lx>rd Devonport. issued liifi fir.-t n.aximum 

 pi ice-, w ith regard to cereals? 'i 



2600. That was on the advice of a very strongly 

 formed Committee who dealt with tho whole .si-hjoi -t 

 in the form of a Id-port? Yes, I romomlier. 



3610. Mr. J. M. Henderson suggested to you that 



prices had possibly been above what they might have 



if there hud boon no control. Is it your opinion 



[)t as regards potatoes? No, except as regards 



potatoes, and I think in certain months possibly milk 



tthi-n there is a surplus. I do not think, except 



in thow and one or two minor instances, that that 



u the case. 



2611. Following up what Mr. J. M. Hcnd 

 alluded to as to the supply of milk to depots, the price 

 would IH tin- same to any depot? YI-K. the maxi 

 mum price would. 



2612. Practically part of our policy has been to 

 arrange for tho setting up of depots in order to 

 provide for letter distribution? Yes. 



2613. That has been part of our policy?- x 



2614. It was not the policy of the rood Control 

 of the Ministry to do-control fending stuffs? Are 

 von sneaking of tho oarlv part of this year? 



18 YW- No. 



'J-,l<;. That was tho decision of the All 



, il -.coda and fate oil seeds certainly was a direct 

 4*hinet dacininn. 



1W17. 1 am referring to all the fooding cakes 

 linseed, cotton, and other cakes. The joln> <-: tin- 

 Food Ministry was to continue contnil:- I <!<> not 

 know to what extent you can (say tin v lad a 

 policy different from that of tin- (lou-mincm. 1 

 think 1 am right in saying we .should him- i.nln-r 

 proposed to continue the import of feeding stuffs 

 that is to aay of cakes. 



2618. Surely we intimated our opinion to that 

 ,liWt to the Cabinet? Yes. 



2619. But that H.I-. opposed by the Hoard of Agri- 

 culture? I believe BO. 



2620. The Cabinet decided to de-control feeding 

 cakes? Your recollection of this is better than mine. 

 1 think that was the course of events. 



2621. I wanted to get it out because I think that 

 the Commission ought to know what the position 

 was. It was because of the decision to de-control 

 that prices of feeding stuffs at once began to rise? 



> ex. 



2622. Dr. Douglas: You have very naturally and 

 truly taken credit to your department for tin 

 that ita control of prices has not diminished pro- 

 duction. Of c-our.-i Ogni that tliciv 

 considerable forces making for production at tho 

 came time the Food Production Campaign, ior ex- 

 ample? I hope I di<! not mean to imply that we had 

 all tho credit. I merely wanted to claim the nega- 

 tive credit. 



2623. Your prices were such as to enable production 

 to go on to the full extent? Yes, and to some extent 

 encouraged it. 



. I quite agree. Of course, I do not make tins 

 a matter of criticism at all, but merely a mat: 

 fact. Apart from price controls there were a great 

 many interferences with the industry that became 

 necessary as part of your policy? Yes. 



"-. Such as prohibiting the slaughter of certain 

 animals, and ordering the slaughter of animals thai 

 their owners would have thought it profitable to keep, 

 and so on. There were many matters of thai 

 which did reflect on the profits of agriculturist*. 1 

 do not put it as a matter of complaint, but that 

 is the fact? I would not deny it. 



2626. Obviously you have not been able to make 

 any sort of reckoning of tho total cost of that to 

 those engaged in tho industry. It would be impossible 

 to measure the total cost of that in figures? I do not 

 think it is great, if I may say so. 



2627. That must be a matter of pure conjecture 

 as long as no account of it has been taken? Yes. 



2628. It has certainly not been a matter pressing 

 equally upon all; it has pressed more on sonic than 

 on others? All controls press unequally. 



3629. That is a necessary part of control? Yes. 



3630. The object of the |x>tato guarantee was to 

 stimulate production, was it not? Yes. 



3631. As a matter of essential food policy? 

 ;inly. 



26;}2. And to bring about production on land on 

 which, apart from that guarantee, it would not have 

 been thought profitable or expedient to grow potatoes? 



-V,:r.!. I suppose your endeavour was to find HO tar 

 ,11 could a price that would give a fair return, 

 if not a profit, even in the more unfavourable con- 

 ditions? Certainly. 



3634. It was therefore an inevitable accompaniment 

 of that policy that profits should have Keen 

 exceedingly large in the more favourable positions? 

 Y. - 



3635. Those profits have excited very naturally a 

 certain amount of unfavourable comment, but yon 

 would regard an incident of that sort as n-alU 

 inseparable from control which was to give an 

 price and to give a return or avoid u loss in the 

 unfavourable conditions? In tho case of potai, 

 think the high profits made in some cases and tl 



to the Treasury is a very small insurance premium 

 for the risk that we covered assuming the war had 

 gone on. 



2fi.'if>. And really an inevitable loss? Quite 



2W Take the'cnse of milk. You have put it t . 



us that you experienced great variation in I ho 



estimates of cost; you laid stress, I think, on the word 



wtimat<>. Have von nnv ronnon to doubt that thoro 



