162 



ROYAL COMM >N AOUH I I.ITUK. 



MK. CASTEI.I. WREY. 



[Continued. 



have to know the conditions of the farm as well, you 

 know. You do not know the farm you are talking 

 about, I think. 



4093. I do not know it; but I know a groat number 

 of farmers who come from the saint- count \, who do 

 not look to me, aa if they wi-re making losses such aa 

 you suggest in your accounts. You say that many of 

 those formers "attend markets t> dnys a week? I 



1 what a labourer said to me; but from my <mn 

 knou ledge I know i'f several men who attend four r 

 five times n week. 



4094. And they an- worthy of considerable <i-iisnn- 

 I gre.- with yon in that.' Would you tell us tin- 

 names of some of tli<- fanners who attend markets as 

 frequently as that: 1 Certainly not. 



I' think it is only fair and reasonable if you 

 make a statement of that sort, that you should back 

 it up by giving the names and addresses of the men 

 who are rightly deserving of public censure? I will 

 ask them to allow me to give their names. 

 Chairman : I do not think this is essential. 



4096. Mr. Langford : What material do you suggest 

 the ordinary farmer could purchase and use on his 

 farm which he has not now got? I should say a 

 16-foot seeding drill. I have only seen about three 

 since I have been in England. 



4097. Would you suggest that a drill of that width 

 would be suitable for many farms in England ? Yes, 

 any farm of a reasonable size. I do not say a small 

 holding. That is an absurditv, of course. 



4098. I am afraid we should not agree as to what 

 was a reasonable sized farm. You do not regard 

 2,700 acres as an economical farm? No, I think it 

 w a very uneconomical size. 



4099. I think you said you would regard 10,000 acres 

 as a decent farm that yo'u could successfully manage? 

 I did not say I could" successfully manage it. I said 

 1 thought it was an economical size. 



4100. Do you know how many farms of 10,000 acres 

 there are? Vi-ry few. 



4101. Would you be surprised to hear there are only 

 14.1300 farms of over 300 acres in hng'-<nd? That is 

 about it. 



4102. You have brought with you these two pretty 

 pictures? Yes. 



4103. Do you seriously suggest to the Commission 

 that that is a team that is ordinarily used in agri- 

 culture in England? If it is not. a paper of that 

 standing ought not to publish it. It is an advertise- 

 ment of ignorance. 



HOI. Have you taken up the matter with themP 

 No. 



4105. But you bring it hero because you think upon 

 tli- Commission there are a great many gentlemen 

 who may not be so acquainted with agriculture as 



urn! you are going to ask them to believe 

 that. Do you know what county this (.holograph was 

 taken in? - No: I do not know anything about it. It 

 simply struck mo what brutal ignorance it was, and 

 I brought it. 



4106. Is that class of hay carter used in your 

 countyP No. 



4107. Then I do not think I need say anything more 

 about that. Have you got electric power on your 

 farm? No. 



4108. Do you know that many of the farmers in 

 England are using it to-day, both for power and light- 

 ing, and even to light their cottages? Very likely. 



4109. Do you know that there are some counties in 

 England that have adopted electricity, and have asked 

 the public authorities who have electric current to 

 dispose of to bring it into the country and link up 

 id.-ir farms? I have not heard of it. 



4110. Herefordshire is one which has petitioned the 

 Town Council, who have large electrical works : and 

 they ar<- now- about to spend a very large capital, 

 otiiething like 100,000 in linking up their farms, 



In 'V realise the great advantages that nccrn* 

 to farmers" by the use of electricity. Won' I 



reran! them as amongst these neople whom you sal 



ultra-conservative? No, I should not. 

 till. .Vr. Thirmn* TTrnrfrr.'on : You an id in rc| ly t<i 

 Mr T,anpford that you have dropped from 

 profit in 1917 to 2.3W! in 191. a total drop of about 

 -? Yes. 



4112. You suggested in reply to him when you were 

 asked for the cuima, that it waa due to an increase in 

 the wages bill? No; 1 said there was an increase. 



lll.'t. ''1 lii-re was an increase of .'!'.!<;. Tlmi only 

 Hts for a quarter of that drop. I think my 

 figures . -ft That is about right. 



1111. Can you account for the 1,100 odd? los. 

 'Ih.-r.- came a very unlucky spring. We had it lot of 

 land i<ll. which ought to h;n- l-i-.-n PI i uli i\ .it ion. 

 On those heavy clays we cannot do what want. 



111".. It was not entirely due to labour? 



tll'i. You MI id in reply tO ,-oine one else, that. .Mini- 

 labour force was .> mm, '-.omen ..nil (in man pi IM.II. i -. 

 I think \ou said II (iermiin prison. 



111". Mow many women have you:' Fifteen or six- 

 teen. 



II IS. That is only 32 ordinary men that you have? 



Yes. 



4119. As compared with 104 men and boys you em- 

 ployed before the war? Yes; the area waa larger in 

 those days. 



4120. How much larger? In 1914 the area was 

 3.609. 



4121. You are short 600 acres? Yes. 



4122. How many of the 3*2 men were actually em- 

 ployed on the farm before the war!' They are all men 

 who were employed, and the boys have grown up on 

 the farm. I have imported very few. 



1123. Could you divide these into categories showing 

 the older men 'and the boys who have grown up? I 

 could not do that from memory. 



4124. You make a charge of inefficiency against your 

 own staff, and your figures are hardly comparable. I 

 do not think you have the materials for a comparison P 

 Why? 



4125. On your own showing you have only 32 of the 

 original 104, and you have 15 women who were not 

 emploved before, I presume, and you have 11 German 

 prisoners whom we cannot compare with anything. Is 

 it quite fair to base your generalisation on such a 

 small basis? Generalisation of what? 



4126. As to the fall in the efficiency of labour? As 

 Chairman of the Food Production Committee of mv 

 district, I am in touch every day of the week with 

 neighbouring farmers, and the complaint is most 

 general, and I see it in evidence myself every day. 



4127. I am not complaining of this not being on a 

 wider basis, but you did not say that to brgin with. 

 You said it was your own personal experience on the 

 farm. Of these 32. some of them would be older men 

 who had been on the farm a long time?- ^ 



4128. Against whom you make no complaint ?- 



4129. So that the complaint finally lies against a 

 iparatively small group of individuals? -Yes, on 



my farm. 



'4130. As a scientist, do you think it is fair to make 

 a wide generalisation of that kind on such a small 

 group of cases 9 The district in which I am Chairman 

 of Food Production is a fairly wide district, and I ha\e 

 complaints very generally from men I can tru-t 



4131. They did not employ for the most part mm 

 who did not come in during the war? I am afraid we 

 do not get many men coming in the industry. 



1132. Yon cannot get them? Very few. 



1 133. So that it applies to tin- younger men solely? 

 Yes. 



4134. And those are very few in number P Yes, 

 worse luck. 



4135. Why is it worse luck if they are inefficient? I 

 wish there were not anv young men 



113fi. You said you believed in the desirability of 

 very large farms. I do not quarrel with vour opinion ; 

 I. nt I put it to you that one essential factor in run- 

 ning laree farms is. that you can depend on an 

 offic-ent labour staff? Yes. 



1137. The difficulty of managing with a small staff 

 will be much greater in the case of a larger staff? 

 it will. 



4138. Can you look forward to nnv increase of 

 farm, with comfort? If I hid a farm of that area. I 

 liould have a prent dcnl of lahour-snving machinery, 

 and T should reduce labour to a minimum. 



41.T9. I agree; but you are bound to have some? 

 Yes. 



4140. Assuming von are riirht in believing thnt 

 lalniiir is so almminnblv inefficient, how can you look 

 forward to the possibility of extending t*e siee of your 



