CONGRESS, UNITED STATES. 



161 



statement by the Senator from Arkansas that 

 vn-li \VJIH the usage in his State. I shall cer- 

 t.iinly t;iU- no issue with tin- Senator from Ar- 

 kansas us to what tin- provision t' the consti- 

 tution of that State is, or what has been tho 

 us.i'.v under it. Hut I think I can say, both to 

 tin- x-nate. and to tho country, if tho Arkansas 

 foii-ritution contains such a provision, and tho 

 preM<l. i iit pro tempore of the Arkansas Senate 

 utter being Governor still presided over tho 

 Senate, that out of the thirty-seven States 

 which constitute this Union Arkansas is tho 

 solitary State where such an anomaly exists. 

 Tho case cited by the Senator from Indiana of 

 the President of the Senate becoming Gover- 

 nor of the State occurred in Kentucky. Indeed, 

 it occurred while I discharged tho executive 

 duties of that Commonwealth. I was elected 

 Lieutonant-Governor on the State ticket in 

 1857 with Hon. John L. Helm, who was elected 

 Governor. Governor Halm died within a few 

 days after taking the oath, at his own home in 

 Hardin County, and without ever reaching tho 

 seat of government. By his death I as Lieuten- 

 ant-Governor became acting Governor of tho 

 Commonwealth of Kentucky and acted as such 

 for one year, when I was elected Governor. 

 There was then no Lietitenant-Governor, the 

 law having made no provision for the election 

 of one.' The Lieutenant-Governor, by tho terms 

 of the constitution of Kentucky, is elected by 

 the people and presides over the Senate. When 

 I was elected Governor, the Senate of Ken- 

 tucky elected lion. P. II. Leslie president of that 

 body, who, when I was elected to this body, 

 was qualified as Governor and served out my 

 nnexpired term. Hud the people of Kentucky 

 boon informed that Governor Leslie after qual- 

 ifying as Governor could still have presided in 

 the Senate, or that he was subject to removal 

 from tho office of Governor except for cause, I 

 am sure they would have been confounded. 



"Mr. President, any construction of any 

 clause of the Constitution of the United States, 

 or tho constitution of any State, which would 

 confer upon the Senate of the United States 

 the right to remove at its pleasure tho Presi- 

 dent pro temvore after he had become Presi- 

 dent of tho United States, without cause and 

 at its pleasure, or which would in a State 

 authorize the Senate to remove the president 

 pro tempore after he had become invested with 

 tho executive duties as Governor or acting 

 Governor, must be erroneous. Such a construc- 

 tion carries its own refutation. It would lead 

 to mischief which could not be estimated. It 

 was against such results that the Federal Con- 

 stitution, in my judgment, intended to provide. 



"The intimation of the Senator from Indi- 

 ana that the President pro tempore of the Sen- 

 ate, after becoming President of the United 

 States, might still preside in the Senate, is novel 

 and extniordinury. It seems to be unsupported 

 by law and unsustained by usage. Such a doc- 

 trine finds no support in the usage of the State 

 governments, unless in Arkansas." 



Mr. Thurman said : " If it does not inter- 

 rupt the argument of my friend from Ken- 

 tucky, I can name two instances in my own 

 State in which the governorship of the State 

 devolved on the Speaker of the Senate, and in 

 each of those cases it was decided that the 

 Speaker accepting tho office of Governor va- 

 cated his seat as senator.'* 



Mr. Conkling : " Does the Constitution de- 

 volve the duties on him ? " 



Mr. Thurman : " In the very words of the 

 Constitution of the United States." 



Mr. Conkling: "That he shall act as Gov- 

 ernor?" 



Mr. Thurman: "Yes, sir; the words are 

 copied from the Constitution of the United 

 States. It was so held for a plain reason, too 

 plain for argument, that it is impossible that 

 the legislative and executive powers or the 

 judicial and executive powers of government 

 can be vested in the same individual. 



" Upon the question that is immediately be- 

 fore the Senate, and as to which I have said 

 that I was not entirely clear, but that the im- 

 pression of my mind was in favor of the views 

 of the minority of the committee, I wish to say 

 a very few words indeed : 



The Senate shall choose their other officers, and 

 also a President pro tempore, in the absence of the 

 Vice-P resident, or when he shall exercise the office 

 of President or the United States. 



" I wish the attention of the Senator from 

 Indiana for one moment. The Senator says 

 that the power conferred in this clause is pre- 

 cisely the same in respect to the President of 

 the Senate that it is in respect to ' the other 

 officers,' and that if it is competent for the 

 Senate to remove its Secretary, or its Chief 

 Clerk, or its Sergeant-at- Arms, it follows neces- 

 sarily that it has a like power to remove the 

 President pro tempore. I submit to him that 

 he is entirely mistaken in that. There is not 

 one word in this clause that by any implication 

 whatever fixes the duration of the office of 

 any officer of tho Senate except the President 

 pro tempore. There is not one word in tho 

 clause, which, either expressly or by any im- 

 plication, fixes the term of office of the Secre- 

 tary of the Senate, of the Chief Clerk of the 

 Senate, of the Sergeant-at-Arms, or of any 

 of those officers who are strictly officers of the 

 Senate. But, when you come to the President 

 pro tempore, there are most pregnant words 

 that do intimate, that do raise a fair implica- 

 tion, if they do not express it in fact, that he is 

 to hold during the entire absence of the Vice- 

 President, and, if that absence be caused by 

 death, as in the case now before us, that then 

 he must continue to hold as long as he is a 

 member of the body, unless, in the mean time, 

 another Vice-President has been chosen. Let 

 us see how this matter is: 



The Vice-President of the United State* shall he 

 President of the Senate, but shall have no vote, etc. 

 The Senate shall choose their other officers. 



"Why was the clause 'The Senate shall 



